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After ruining a treasured water resource, Iran is drying up

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Re: After ruining a treasured water resource, Iran is drying up

#311

Post by breppp »

MangoToupe wrote: post #291
breppp wrote: post #233

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Examples: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iran_hostage_crisis https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1983_Beirut_barracks_bombings https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/William_Francis_Buckley https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Terry_A._Anderson https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AMIA_bombing https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2016_U.S.%E2%80%93Iran_naval_i... https://www.iranintl.com/en/202408126589 Because that's their entire MO for their existence…

Ok, I don't see a comparison happening. Israel seems to kill americans on a regular basis. Saudi arabia doesn't seem to be much friendlier either, not to mention refusing to align with our proclaimed values. You gotta do more to convince me that iran is any worse than either Half the things you linked barely have anything to do with iran; certainly much less connection than saudi arabia had with 9/11. Do better!

> Ok, I don't see a comparison happening. Israel seems to kill americans on a regular basis. Saudi arabia doesn't seem to be much friendlier either, not to mention refusing to align with our proclaimed values

Both statements are false, Israel does not "kill americans on a regular basis" and Saudi Arabia has not supported proxy warfare killing thousands of Americans.

The links I pasted are well established to Iran, I can post more but that would waste both of our time as you try to synthesize new facts

Re: After ruining a treasured water resource, Iran is drying up

#312

Post by breppp »

vkou wrote: post #286
breppp wrote: post #249

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Cuba and the US were very close to normalizing under Obama IIRC. What do you think about Vietnamese-US relations?

They are only fine because Vietnam is useful to the US as a regional counterweight to China.

So why Iran won't be fine since the US just wants to remove them off the Chinese sphere and remove a Russian arms supplier?

I don't follow the logic why Iran has no way out

Re: After ruining a treasured water resource, Iran is drying up

#313

Post by mrits »

Waterluvian wrote: post #24
mrits wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The American "regime" has a country that people are literally fighting in line to get into.

Not only is that wrong, it’s not relevant to the topic of a regime doing dumb things and then trying to scapegoat. I think the extent to which it’s effective may be a proxy for an electorate’s intellectual health. So while we see failures to take responsibility (what role models the world has for leaders…), that scapegoating doesn’t always work. And if so, not for long. What got me thinking about this is the Conserva…

We will get to find out if Canada's prosperity was due to their own merit and not located next to the US. good luck

Re: After ruining a treasured water resource, Iran is drying up

#314

Post by MangoToupe »

breppp wrote: post #311
MangoToupe wrote: post #291

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ok, I don't see a comparison happening. Israel seems to kill americans on a regular basis. Saudi arabia doesn't seem to be much friendlier either, not to mention refusing to align with our proclaimed values. You gotta do more to convince me that iran is any worse than either Half the things you linked barely have anything to do with iran; certainly much less connection than saudi arabia had with 9/11. Do better!

> Ok, I don't see a comparison happening. Israel seems to kill americans on a regular basis. Saudi arabia doesn't seem to be much friendlier either, not to mention refusing to align with our proclaimed values Both statements are false, Israel does not "kill americans on a regular basis" and Saudi Arabia has not supported proxy warfare killing thousands of Americans. The links I pasted are well established to Iran, I…

> Both statements are false, Israel does not "kill americans on a regular basis"

Have you not turned on the news recently? The IDF regularly bombs american citizens living in palestine.

Then there's the USS Liberty bombing: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USS_Liberty_incident

Not to mention the likely hundreds of americans assassinated by mossad, cf Rise First And Kill

> Saudi Arabia has not supported proxy warfare killing thousands of Americans.

Have you never heard of 9/11? Also Wtf are you referring to? None of the proxy wars allegedly funded by iran (as if we haven't done orders of magnitude more evil things with proxy wars, cf the war in ukraine) have killed "thousands of americans".

And frankly, even if this were credible, who could blame them given the sanctions? We're actively destroying their ability to live life for seeming no reason other than arbitrary geopolitical control.

Re: After ruining a treasured water resource, Iran is drying up

#315

Post by pphysch »

wahern wrote: post #225
pphysch wrote: post #191

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The West hasn't stopped interfering in Iran though. They did massive terrorist attacks there just a year ago. Israel would openly salivate at the prospect of destroying Iranian agriculture and water supply. China is an interesting counterfactual. Circa 2010 when Xi came to power, the CPC also essentially destroyed the CIA's footprint in the country, something that was not widely reported in the West. And PRC has done…

> Circa 2010 when Xi came to power, the CPC also essentially destroyed the CIA's footprint in the country, something that was not widely reported in the West. And PRC has done very well since... The PRC was doing just as fine before they executed all the CIA's agents. I don't see any relation. There's never been any hint from either the US or China that those agents were doing anything other than passive intelligence…

> There's never been any hint from either the US or China that those agents were doing anything other than passive intelligence collection, as opposed to actively interfering in domestic Chinese politics. And in any event, the scope of historical CIA operations has always been overblown. In every case I'm aware of, the CIA leveraged a tipping point already well underway to nudge things one way or another.

Beyond being self-contradictory (CIA is passive but also they interfere on key issues) this is just false. The West has spent a lot of (covert) resources undermining China in the past decade in Hong Kong, Xinjiang, Taiwan, trade and tech wars, COVID, and so on. All attempts which have failed dramatically, perhaps partly due to the lack of IC penetration into society and government.

Re: After ruining a treasured water resource, Iran is drying up

#316

Post by tguvot »

owenversteeg wrote: post #282
baxtr wrote: post #73

Maybe it’s selection bias but: The saddest thing about Iran I’ve noticed is the stark contrast between the current state of the country and the intelligence of the people I’ve met from this country.

This discussion comes up from time to time on HN. I actually think the country _has_ accomplished a lot given their geopolitical situation. Just to list a few things in the 21st century: 1) they had years of (at times fairly successful) proxy wars with three of the most militarily powerful US allies until the recent collapse, 2) a nuclear program, 3) the largest ballistic missile attack in history against the US, and…

actually Israel is the one who came up with with "shahed drones" more than 20 years ago https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IAI_Harop

Re: After ruining a treasured water resource, Iran is drying up

#317

Post by ch4s3 »

geraneum wrote: post #308
ch4s3 wrote: post #290

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A referendum held outside of the legal process after he probably lost the previous election.

And what did people vote for in that “outside of legal process” referendum? edit: typo

Well the vote was a sham with no secret ballots and separate voting tents for yes and no votes. Armed members of Tudeh were at almost every poling station, there were wide spread reports of members of Mossadegh's party voting multiple times, and the vote count came out to 99.99% "yes'. On top of being illegal it was obviously fraudulent. It is at times called a coup by Mossadegh.

Re: After ruining a treasured water resource, Iran is drying up

#318

Post by ch4s3 »

cess11 wrote: post #300
ch4s3 wrote: post #260

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> increasing the power of the majlis Right up until he was about to lose an election, then he suspended counting votes and tried to dissolve the Majlis in alliance with the communist party.

Not sure what you mean. In the -52 election he stopped the vote counting when enough of the majlis was filled that it could legally do work, and then tried to form a government which the shah blocked. This is what led to the proposal that the majlis give him six months of emergency powers.

He stopped the voting when he had enough friendly members, contra the constitution.

Re: After ruining a treasured water resource, Iran is drying up

#319

Post by davidjytang »

baxtr wrote: post #73

Maybe it’s selection bias but: The saddest thing about Iran I’ve noticed is the stark contrast between the current state of the country and the intelligence of the people I’ve met from this country.

Visited Iran twice. They had a huge billboard that says “Down with USA”. However that sentiment is nowhere to be found in the individual-level interactions during my stay there.

Re: After ruining a treasured water resource, Iran is drying up

#320

Post by MangoToupe »

_DeadFred_ wrote: post #236
MangoToupe wrote: post #133

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Believe it or not, other things do happen in the country aside from what is reported on in western media. Claiming this is all they do is heinously ignorant.

Yep, like supplying drones and missiles to Russia to be used on Ukrainian civilians in Russia's war for colonization.

Oh no, someone sold europe a shiv to stab itself with. Where can we donate?
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