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Search tool that only returns content created before ChatGPT's public release

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Re: Search tool that only returns content created before ChatGPT's public release

#311

Post by troyvit »

alessioalex wrote: post #279
troyvit wrote: post #256

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So if America invades Venezuela should we all stop using google? Should we have stopped using google when the U.S. invaded Iraq and killed 150,000 people[1]? Should we stop using products imported from China for the cultural genocide they've perpetrated against the Uyghurs?[2] Is Yandex Russia? [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Casualties_of_the_Iraq_War [2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persecution_of_Uyghurs_in_Chi…

You can take whatever stand you want. When there’s a country that killed, raped and tried to exterminate most of Eastern Europe we can choose to cut any and all ties with it and consider them for all intents and purposes ..terrorists.

I sort-of see where you're coming from, but it also ignores a double standard to me. Don't buy search from a company that uses an api from another company that is (or was? unclear) based in a country that invaded another country and completely upended the world order. For some people that's a line that they don't want to cross and I get it.

However if that's the case how can they continue buying Chinese products when China has done the same thing, but worse, and for longer, to their own population? Because it's less convenient to stop? _That_ to me lands squarely in the "take whatever stand you want" category with the addendum of, "and don't worry if it doesn't make sense."

Is it because it's within their own borders and therefore isn't our problem?

Re: Search tool that only returns content created before ChatGPT's public release

#312

Post by SoftTalker »

maplethorpe wrote: post #25
tkgally wrote: post #16

Somewhat related, the leaderboard of em-dash users on HN before ChatGPT: https://www.gally.net/miscellaneous/hn-em-dash-user-leaderbo...

They should include users who used a double hyphen, too -- not everyone has easy access to em dashes.

Double-hyphen is an en-dash. Triple-hyphen is an em-dash.

Re: Search tool that only returns content created before ChatGPT's public release

#313

Post by dragonwriter »

SoftTalker wrote: post #312
maplethorpe wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They should include users who used a double hyphen, too -- not everyone has easy access to em dashes.

Double-hyphen is an en-dash. Triple-hyphen is an em-dash.

Double hyphen is replaced in some software with an en-dash (and in those, a triple hyphen is often replaced with an em-dash), and in some with an em-dash; its usually used (other than as input to one of those pieces of software) in places where an em-dash would be appropriate, but in contexts where both an em-dash set closed and an en-dash set open might be used, it is often set open.

So, it’s not unambiguously s substitute for either is essentially its own punctuation mark used in ASCII-only environments with some influence from both the use of em-dashed and that of en-dashes in more formal environments.

Re: Search tool that only returns content created before ChatGPT's public release

#314

Post by dragonwriter »

bigiain wrote: post #80
maplethorpe wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They should include users who used a double hyphen, too -- not everyone has easy access to em dashes.

That would false positive me. I have used double dashes to delimit quote attribution for decades. Like this: "You can't believe everything you read on the internet." -- Abraham Lincoln, personal correspondence, 1863

That's literally a standard use of em-dash being approximated by a double hyphen, though.

Re: Search tool that only returns content created before ChatGPT's public release

#315

Post by dragonwriter »

greenicon wrote: post #152
kuschku wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That depends on the language — whereas German puts spaces around —, English afaik usually doesn’t. Similarly, French puts spaces before and after ? ! while English and German only put spaces afterwards. [EDIT: I originally wrote that French treats . , ! ? specially. In reality, french only treats ? and ! specially.]

In German you use en-dashes with spaces, whereas in English it’s em-dashes without spaces. Some people dislike em-dashes in English though and use en-dashes with spaces as well.

In English, typically em-dashes are set without spaces or with thin spaces when used to separate appositives/parentheticals (though that style isn't universal even in professional print, there are places that aet them open, and en-dashes set open can also be used in this role); when representating an interruption, they generally have no space before but frequently have space following. And other uses have other patterns.

Re: Search tool that only returns content created before ChatGPT's public release

#316

Post by xnx »

shevy-java wrote: post #119

> This is a search tool that will only return content created before ChatGPT's first public release on November 30, 2022. The problem is that Google's search engine - but, oddly enough, ALL search engines - got worse before that already. I noticed that search engines got worse several years before 2022. So, AI further decreased the quality, but the quality had a downwards trend already, as it was. There are some atte…

Counterpoint: The experience of quickly finding succinct accurate responses to queries has never been better.

Years ago, I would consider a search "failed" if the page with related information wasn't somewhere in the top 10. Now a search is "failed" if the AI answer doesn't give me exactly what I'm looking for directly.

Re: Search tool that only returns content created before ChatGPT's public release

#318

Post by strbean »

duxup wrote: post #235
zipy124 wrote: post #151

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Honestly the biggest failing is just SEO spam sites got too good at defeating the algorithm. The amount of bloody listicles or quora nonsense or backlink farming websties that come up in search is crazy.

I feel like google gave up the fight at some point. I think HN had some good articles that indicated that.

Certainly seems that way if you observed the waves of usability Google search underwent in the first 15 years. There was several distinct cycles where the results were great, then garbage, then great again. They would be flooded with SEO spam, then they would tweak and penalize the SEO spam heavily, then SEO would catch up.

The funny thing is that it seems like when they gave up it wasn't because some new advancement in the arms race. It was well before LLMs hit the scene. The SEO spam was still incredibly obvious to a human reader. Really seems like some data-driven approach demonstrated that surrendering on this front led to increased ad revenue.

Re: Search tool that only returns content created before ChatGPT's public release

#319

Post by strbean »

AznHisoka wrote: post #191
zipy124 wrote: post #151

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Honestly the biggest failing is just SEO spam sites got too good at defeating the algorithm. The amount of bloody listicles or quora nonsense or backlink farming websties that come up in search is crazy.

For most commercial related terms, I suspect if you got rid of all “spanmy” results you would be left with almost nothing. No independent blogger is gonna write about the best credit card with travel points.

Sites like Credit Karma / NerdWallet exist. While I think they are rife with affiliate link nonsense and paid promotion masquerading as advice, I'm also pretty sure they have paid researchers and writers generating genuine content. Not sure that quite falls into the bucket of SEO blogspam.

Re: Search tool that only returns content created before ChatGPT's public release

#320

Post by varjag »

tryauuum wrote: post #220
varjag wrote: post #203

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You are talking about an entity whose ownership is 99.8% Russian nationals and state companies; whose employees for the most part are Russian nationals, whose main market is Russia and with very little tangible assets that can be arrested in the Netherlands. The only reason for this "divestment" is sanctions evasion.

you clearly don't know anything about nebius They have a lot of hardware in e.g. Finland. I don't think they provide GPU access to the russian companies, feel free to correct me

We were talking search engines here, but interesting indeed! What's the name of Neibus CEO?
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