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Alibaba Cloud says it cut Nvidia AI GPU use by 82% with new pooling system

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Re: Alibaba Cloud says it cut Nvidia AI GPU use by 82% with new pooling system

#311

Post by heavyset_go »

wagwang wrote: post #299
dontlaugh wrote: post #276

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes. Imperialism (as a system of extracting wealth from poor countries) continues to exist, but China has a working countermeasure. You can see similar with Vietnam.

Sure if you water down the term of imperialism then yes. It is then incumbent on you to prove "imperialism" among the worst performers economically. What imperialism plagues liberia and ethiopia and honduras and papua new guinea

Papau New Guinea was ravaged by imperialism, invaded by imperial Japan and then was a meat grinder warfront in WWII. It was controlled by Australia since then.

Similarly in WWI, it was invaded by Australia and only gained independence in 1975.

Before that, it was split between Germany, the British and Dutch.

Before that, its population was impressed and blackbirded by European traders.

Like cargo cults literally developed there lol

Re: Alibaba Cloud says it cut Nvidia AI GPU use by 82% with new pooling system

#312

Post by Cyph0n »

wagwang wrote: post #300
Cyph0n wrote: post #207

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But I just pointed out that China is an exception? Also, China had access to human capital at a scale that no African country had. Japan pre-45 was a world power, and had industrialized by the early 1900s. WW2 was a mere setback. Korea is more of a “miracle” than Japan was, but they also did well to industrialize ASAP. They also didn’t face the brunt of European colonialism.

Lots of miracles and exceptions in a working theory

Lots? There are 100 or so countries between Asia and Africa. And we are talking about a handful of East Asian countries.

Re: Alibaba Cloud says it cut Nvidia AI GPU use by 82% with new pooling system

#313

Post by Cyph0n »

shakow wrote: post #275
Cyph0n wrote: post #207

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But I just pointed out that China is an exception? Also, China had access to human capital at a scale that no African country had. Japan pre-45 was a world power, and had industrialized by the early 1900s. WW2 was a mere setback. Korea is more of a “miracle” than Japan was, but they also did well to industrialize ASAP. They also didn’t face the brunt of European colonialism.

> They also didn’t face the brunt of European colonialism. But they faced the brunt of Chinese & Japanese colonialism, and a full-blown civil war after which their GDP per capita was in the same ballpark as Kenya's.

Yes, they did well given the odds.

Re: Alibaba Cloud says it cut Nvidia AI GPU use by 82% with new pooling system

#314

Post by narrator »

hunglee2 wrote: post #2

The US attempt to slow down China's technological development succeeds on the basis of preventing China from directly following the same path, but may backfire in the sense it forces innovation by China in a different direction. The overall outcome for us all may be increase efficiency as a result of this forced innovation, especially if Chinese companies continue to open source their advances, so we may in the end h…

Peaceful competition is a good thing. It's better than a unified one world government throttling everybody.

Re: Alibaba Cloud says it cut Nvidia AI GPU use by 82% with new pooling system

#315

Post by brookst »

ahmeneeroe-v2 wrote: post #160
brookst wrote: post #131

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The US has become unreliable and erratic. Countries aren’t cutting ties or anything, but certainly investing to reduce exposure to capricious US leadership. Much of Europe is increasing domestic military production rather than just buying more from the US precisely because the US has publicly discussed leaving NATO and/or not honoring its guarantees.

Increasing domestic military production is actually a great outcome. Obviously Wall Street would have preferred purchasing from US-listed/owned arms companies, but from the perspective of a military alliance, having well-armed allies is the main point. It's really hard to argue with Trump's methods if they led to Europe finally spending on their own defense.

That’s moving the goalposts.

The fact that they are doing this because they don’t trust the US to honor its commitments is a very different proposition from “maybe it’s for the best”.

And if you’re familiar with world war 1 and 2, you might doubt that significant increase in domestic military production is a wholly good thing.

But point stands: it’s an example of formerly-strong alliance that is no longer trusted.

Re: Alibaba Cloud says it cut Nvidia AI GPU use by 82% with new pooling system

#316

Post by wagwang »

heavyset_go wrote: post #311
wagwang wrote: post #299

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sure if you water down the term of imperialism then yes. It is then incumbent on you to prove "imperialism" among the worst performers economically. What imperialism plagues liberia and ethiopia and honduras and papua new guinea

Papau New Guinea was ravaged by imperialism, invaded by imperial Japan and then was a meat grinder warfront in WWII. It was controlled by Australia since then. Similarly in WWI, it was invaded by Australia and only gained independence in 1975. Before that, it was split between Germany, the British and Dutch. Before that, its population was impressed and blackbirded by European traders. Like cargo cults literally deve…

So what, china in 1975 was a completely destroyed country, comparable to north korea

Re: Alibaba Cloud says it cut Nvidia AI GPU use by 82% with new pooling system

#317

Post by wagwang »

Cyph0n wrote: post #312
wagwang wrote: post #300

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Lots of miracles and exceptions in a working theory

Lots? There are 100 or so countries between Asia and Africa. And we are talking about a handful of East Asian countries.

I wonder if there are some other factors here considering the geographical clustering.

Re: Alibaba Cloud says it cut Nvidia AI GPU use by 82% with new pooling system

#318

Post by heavyset_go »

wagwang wrote: post #316
heavyset_go wrote: post #311

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Papau New Guinea was ravaged by imperialism, invaded by imperial Japan and then was a meat grinder warfront in WWII. It was controlled by Australia since then. Similarly in WWI, it was invaded by Australia and only gained independence in 1975. Before that, it was split between Germany, the British and Dutch. Before that, its population was impressed and blackbirded by European traders. Like cargo cults literally deve…

So what, china in 1975 was a completely destroyed country, comparable to north korea

You asked what imperialism affected Papau New Guinea and I answered you. I'm not making an argument or addressing anything other than that from your post.

Re: Alibaba Cloud says it cut Nvidia AI GPU use by 82% with new pooling system

#319

Post by JuniperMesos »

dlisboa wrote: post #11
hunglee2 wrote: post #2

The US attempt to slow down China's technological development succeeds on the basis of preventing China from directly following the same path, but may backfire in the sense it forces innovation by China in a different direction. The overall outcome for us all may be increase efficiency as a result of this forced innovation, especially if Chinese companies continue to open source their advances, so we may in the end h…

History has shown that withholding technology from China does not significantly stop them and they'll achieve it (or better) in a small number of years. In many senses there's hubris in the western* view of China accomplishments: most of what western companies have created has had significant contribution by Chinese scientists or manufacturing, without which those companies would have nothing. If you look at the name…

What term would you prefer? When you say "western view of China", do you mean to include or not include Latin American countries as part of the group of countries you claim has a hubristic view of China's accomplishments?

Re: Alibaba Cloud says it cut Nvidia AI GPU use by 82% with new pooling system

#320

Post by FooBarWidget »

xadhominemx wrote: post #307
FooBarWidget wrote: post #264

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You severely underestimate what they can do with alternative tech paths. You don't have to chase nanometers for good AI system outcomes. Their current, and very viable, strategy is to build a ton of slower chips and to pump in a humongous amount of power. And to optimize the software stack, e.g. more efficient architectures. Unlike the west, they have a lot of cheap power (think solar panels in the desert) and excell…

There are workarounds and paths forward, but they are definitely being slowed down. I know a lot about this topic.

That sounds like you are moving the goalpost: winning through a narrow definition of "slowing down". Defining "slowing down" as "not having access to western semiconductor ecosystem or 2nm chips" instead of "can they build economically viable AI systems/phones that achieve user objectives satisfactorily, and at scale" does not help your country/bloc with any meaningful outcomes, and merely serves to score Internet points to feel good.
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