Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Imgur pulls out of UK as data watchdog threatens fine

express.co.uk

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

311–320 of 735 posts

Re: Imgur pulls out of UK as data watchdog threatens fine

#311

Post by lores »

psychoslave wrote: post #212
andai wrote: post #177

WhatsApp, Telegram and everyone else should pull out of EU in protest of Chat Control. Then EU will be forced to make its own chat app, UX will be terrible, and citizens will finally feel enough pain to contact their representatives ;)

I did contacted them. All of them who didn't yet have a referenced public position on fight chat control for France. By phone. Only two responded with a clear alignment. Good that I did it by phone, because apparently for some of them getting several thousand emails per day can only mean they are victim of a spam attack. Not only they don't represent anything but there own little interests, but they won't even have t…

Was it a Green and a Nazi?

Re: Imgur pulls out of UK as data watchdog threatens fine

#312

Post by protocolture »

We desperately need an Antarctica/Moon style extraterritoriality for the internet.

Just tell your citizens that the internet is fair game? Why restrict it to this level and make using the internet the same as having to understand the law in 200 odd countries.

Re: Imgur pulls out of UK as data watchdog threatens fine

#313

Post by hdgvhicv »

jacquesm wrote: post #195
hdgvhicv wrote: post #147

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Many countries countries witch apply their laws outside there jurisdiction and borders USA (Kim dotcom) Russia (Skripals) China (Teng Bio) Israel (Mordechai Vanunu)

USA BetonSports / https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Carruthers

He was in America then, if you go to America then you’re going to get arrested - Skylarov found that out.

The cases I listed the people were not in the country which performed the actions (dotcom in Nz but upset America, Skripal in UK but upset Russia, etc)

If you break Thai law and insult their king it’s generally good enough to simply not go to Thailand. Piss off the wrong country though and they will persue you to a third country even without extradition agreements

(Then there cases like Gary McKinnon where they try to extradite you and make your life hell even if they lose. He’d never been to America but they tried very hard to extradite him there)

If a country wants you, it will get you. If it wants to protect you, it will, if it is powerful enough. When an American killed Harry Dunn she fled and was protected by America.

Re: Imgur pulls out of UK as data watchdog threatens fine

#314

Post by agedclock »

lurk2 wrote: post #170
seanhunter wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You already need to care depending on what you are serving, and this has been the case for at least 20 years to my knowledge. The most obvious example of this is websites from the UK or Europe which operate any kind of gambling. [1] This may well be legal (based on licensing) in their jurisdiction, but they still need to restrict access to prevent US people from accessing the service or they will be breaching the US'…

> but they still need to restrict access to prevent US people from accessing the service or they will be breaching the US's gambling laws. Why not just avoid travel to the US?

There is a huge number of countries that will comply with the US. All of Western Europe, a good portion of Asia and the Pacific and plenty of other places that I've forgotten about.

If you are wanted in the Western world and the US wants you, you are likely to be got.

Re: Imgur pulls out of UK as data watchdog threatens fine

#315

Post by lokar »

kimixa wrote: post #237
nadermx wrote: post #144

The UK has been doing this sort of stuff for at least a decade. For example they have the PIPCU which under the guise of copyright threatens 10 years in prison for sites not even in their jurisdiction. https://torrentfreak.com/uk-police-launch-campaign-to-shut-d... And with that, they have at the least gotten registrars not located in their jurisdicrion to transfer domains https://easydns.com/blog/2013/10/08/whatever…

The US has always claimed jurisdiction on foreign-hosted but US-accessible content. Do people forget the owner of Megaupload being extradited? In many ways this is just catching up to the current US state. And there's a lot of confusion here between basic consumer data protection laws and (IMHO massively overreaching) "Online Safety" laws. This isn't Imgur making a stand for free speech, this is Imgur wanting to trac…

Don't nations have some right to enforce their copyright laws (civil and criminal) outside their own territory, via treaty?

Re: Imgur pulls out of UK as data watchdog threatens fine

#316

Post by betaby »

layer8 wrote: post #191
betaby wrote: post #175

Earlier quoted context omitted.

HTTP GET is pull, not push. The user is pulling data, not the server is pushing data. Government doesn't care though. It intentionally have chosen not to understand that detail.

It’s the server’s choice to send or not to send the data. The fact that the server is receiving a request for the data in no way implies that it has to obey it. If someone places an order for a product whose distribution violates a law, the distributor is still responsible for sending it. Someone selling drugs is still responsible even if the buyer requested the drug. Someone distributing unlicensed material is still…

NO, bad analogy. A shop in Amsterdam sells shrums in Amsterdam, which is legal. User from UK buys shrums, transaction happens in Amsterdam, which is legal. User brings shrums to UK, that's illegal and the user is liable, not the shop in Amsterdam.

Re: Imgur pulls out of UK as data watchdog threatens fine

#317

Post by lokar »

jobs_throwaway wrote: post #260
kimixa wrote: post #237

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The US has always claimed jurisdiction on foreign-hosted but US-accessible content. Do people forget the owner of Megaupload being extradited? In many ways this is just catching up to the current US state. And there's a lot of confusion here between basic consumer data protection laws and (IMHO massively overreaching) "Online Safety" laws. This isn't Imgur making a stand for free speech, this is Imgur wanting to trac…

The notion that a 17 year old cannot consent to user tracking is absurd

Why is it absurd?

IMO, the law should establish some parental rights over their children, I don't think this is controversial. You can argue with what the limits of the rights are, how they interact with the rights of the child, and how that changes as the child ages, but the basic ideas is pretty sound.

And then given that, it is the role of an elected government to determine all these factors, subject to review of the courts. That all seems to be working here.

Re: Imgur pulls out of UK as data watchdog threatens fine

#318

Post by lokar »

FinnKuhn wrote: post #279
andai wrote: post #177

WhatsApp, Telegram and everyone else should pull out of EU in protest of Chat Control. Then EU will be forced to make its own chat app, UX will be terrible, and citizens will finally feel enough pain to contact their representatives ;)

Why are we talking about the EU in this thread? I don't see how draconian UK laws relate to a proposed chat control law in the EU that hasn't even been drafted and would likely not survive a judicial challenge if it were to be approved.

This is not about the EU, and it's also not about chat control, or encryption.

The only connection I see is "I don't like UK Internet policy"

Re: Imgur pulls out of UK as data watchdog threatens fine

#319

Post by lurk2 »

foldr wrote: post #176
lurk2 wrote: post #165

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The standard you’re proposing would allow Afghanistan to shut down Hacker News on the basis that it provided services to at least one Afghan and the content here violates sharia law.

Afghanistan can do that. You’re protected by Afghanistan’s lack of any realistic ability to enforce laws far outside its borders, not by some general principle of international law saying that countries can’t make laws about websites.

The great-grandparent of my comment was arguing that it’s absurd to suppose that the UK has grounds to go after a company on the basis that the company did business with its citizens on servers located outside of the UK. The UK is effectively making a claim of international jurisdiction on all transactions made by its citizens. The EU does this too with GDPR, the difference (as you noted) is that the EU has enforcement capabilities whereas the UK (like Afghanistan) doesn’t.

Re: Imgur pulls out of UK as data watchdog threatens fine

#320

Post by lmz »

mrtksn wrote: post #288
bapak wrote: post #282

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I hate this so bad. You know that the solution will be that EU will block US companies (who do not comply) so EU users will eventually get their own WhatsApp called MsgMeNow. The result is that nobody can talk to people outside their own jurisdiction. This is effectively what we see in China. They only use WeChat, I was unable to register because it says I need someone to verify my account when I try to do it (this h…

Yes, that's the only way for EU to have a tech industry. That's also how any non-US tech industry exists.

Social network balkanization through mutually incompatible legal requirements. I like it.
Post reply on HN