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Why is Venus hell and Earth an Eden?

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Re: Why is Venus hell and Earth an Eden?

#311

Post by palmotea »

vjvjvjvjghv wrote: post #303
ben7799 wrote: post #277

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Fahrenheit scale is European, not American. It was created in Poland well before the United States broke off from Great Britain. We're just slow to change.

Maybe there is a reverse psychological angle to make the current US administration go metric. Fahrenheit->Polish->European->Communist/Woke. Can't have that!

> Maybe there is a reverse psychological angle to make the current US administration go metric. Fahrenheit->Polish->European->Communist/Woke. Can't have that!

1. That nonsensical, because the same logic would apply to Celsius temperatures.

2. Americans don't keep using Fahrenheit because of some aversion to Europe. Though I do have some fondness for it as resistance to the machine-people who are always going on about efficiency and trying to hurry everyone up.

Re: Why is Venus hell and Earth an Eden?

#312

Post by adornKey »

andrewflnr wrote: post #106
SilverElfin wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What’s the worst case CO2 on earth? Is it as bad as Venus?

Almost the entire length of the linked article is spent answering that question in detail.

Although there's very little information about the most interesting part. What did they use for their modelling? The results suggest somehow that the modelling includes a lot of manual handwaving...

Re: Why is Venus hell and Earth an Eden?

#314

Post by Zardoz84 »

M95D wrote: post #228
NoMoreNicksLeft wrote: post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How do you deorbit Venus is such a way that your inflatable balloon city comes to a gentle stop, 30 miles up, and just floats there? Worse still, when people need to leave and return to Earth, how do you launch a rocket from the balloon city and return to orbit? How do visitors or pioneers deorbit and land at the floating city? If there aren't materials to effect a repair, how long until it sinks down into the hellzo…

> How do you deorbit Venus is such a way that your inflatable balloon city comes to a gentle stop, 30 miles up, and just floats there? Aerobraking with the balloon? A balloon the size of a city would slow down very fast in a thick atmosphere like that, then slowly descend until it reaches the stable altitude. > Worse still, when people need to leave and return to Earth, how do you launch a rocket from the balloon cit…

Facilities on the surface of Venus ? What drug did you take?

First. High temperatures in a corrosive atmosphere. Also, there aren't winds. There are currents. At the surface the atmosphere it's supercritical. It's more like a fluid than a gas.

Re: Why is Venus hell and Earth an Eden?

#315

Post by SwtCyber »

rkagerer wrote: post #124

Venus is arguably the worst place in the solar system From another perspective, its atmosphere is "one of the most Earth-like in the solar system", and scientists long ago postulated the idea of establishing floating cloud cities. Big balloons filled with nitrogen and oxygen would naturally settle at the right altitude, 30 miles above the surface, where gravity, ambient pressure, and radiation aren't far off that of…

Like, Mars gets all the hype, but you're dealing with bone-dry cold, no atmosphere to speak of, and brutal radiation. Meanwhile, Venus has breathable pressure, decent gravity, and no need for pressurized suits... you just have to float above an acid bath.

Re: Why is Venus hell and Earth an Eden?

#316

Post by SwtCyber »

ByteDrifter wrote: post #151

Earth's internal heat regulation is such an underrated hero in the climate story. Half of Earth’s heat comes from internal sources, constantly driving plate tectonics and helping regulate CO₂. Venus lacks that it’s like a pressure cooker with no release valve.

Without that internal churning and subduction pulling CO2 into the mantle, you’re basically stuck in a slow-burn oven, like Venus

Re: Why is Venus hell and Earth an Eden?

#317

Post by ambicapter »

pbmonster wrote: post #268
potato3732842 wrote: post #224

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because it's cheaper to live on a f-ed up half-built construction site of a planet than it is to fight with entrenched interests on earth. Same reason North America got colonized by religious extremists and weirdos.

The free, abundant land choke full of natural resources was probably more important.

There was plenty of death and danger involved in colonizing a foreign land you've never been to with 16th-18th century era technology.

Re: Why is Venus hell and Earth an Eden?

#318

Post by freedomben »

bryant wrote: post #254
ubermonkey wrote: post #250

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A shockingly useful "quick and dirty" estimate for C to F for temps humans are likely to encounter is 2x + 30. It's not precise at all, but for purposes of "what does that feel like outside" or "should I bring a sweater" it works pretty well. 21C would, by this estimate, be 72F. The true conversion is just shy of 70F, so, again, it's not correct but it's close enough for this kind of conversation.

for what it's worth: add 9 degrees F (or 18 if it's easier to remember) for every 5 degrees C (10 C, easier), and peg 32F to 0C. You get: -40F=-40C -22F=-30C -4F =-20C 14F =-10C 32F = 0C 50F = 10C 68F = 20C 86F = 30C 104F= 40C and then approximate in between from there. It's quick enough for me now that I skip the 2x+30.

Always interesting what's easier for some people. Personally 9/5x + 32 is much easier for me to remember and calculate

Re: Why is Venus hell and Earth an Eden?

#319

Post by freedomben »

dredmorbius wrote: post #239
teekert wrote: post #220

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can't because you need to be encapsulated in a balloon to keep the toxic atmosphere out.

EVAs are still likely necessary. Tethering would be useful.

Indeed, though to keep it interesting we should put pinholes through every tenth one

Re: Why is Venus hell and Earth an Eden?

#320

Post by freedomben »

azeemba wrote: post #42

The funny thing is that an oxygen-rich environment is a hell-hole! Oxygen is insanely reactive and will corrode anything. Even early life on earth found oxygen toxic. It was released as a waste product by early life and they were so successful that all that oxygen accumulated resulting in the Great Oxidation Event ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Oxidation_Event ). That likely resulted in many species going exti…

Definitely true, but oxygen is also immensely useful for life evolved to benefit from it, enabling much more complexity. I'm fascinated by the giant insects that got huge back when the oxygen level was much higher.

Related: highly recommend Robert M. Hazen Great Courses and book

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