311–317 of 317 posts
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This is incorrect. Ортодоксальный doesn't carry these connotations at all. If anything, it describes something that is stuck in old ways and/or pointlessly rigid.
православный is used in jargon for exactly that meaning. source: 45 years of native Russian speaking.
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>It isn't because your resting keys require NO finding, so will always be easier You still need to find them unless your hand is glued to the resting keys and even if it were the resting keys might not be hjkl, and even if they are they will by default type hjkl and not move the cursor in any other software you ever use except vim. (It can't be objectively measured of course but I am convinced anyone who can use vim…
> unless your hand is glued to the resting keys It is, the hint is in the name! > even if it were the resting keys might not be hjkl So? Use the other resting keys, resting is key here, not their labels > even if they are they will by default type hjkl and not move the cursor in any other software you ever use except vim. Sorry, but your knowledge of the software world is too shallow, there are other apps that do tha…
Just about any line of text I write daily uses symbols not reachable from the resting position, and once my hand has left that position the arrow keys are easier to find. (Inverted T of course, with home/end/pgdown/pgup cluster).
>there are other apps that do that, specifically, file managers
The point is that you ("you" in this case being a typical user, not you personally) will open applications every day where hjkl does nothing at all with the cursor, and you have to use the arrow keys anyway. This is mental friction that remains even after you spent years internalizing the hjkl cursor moving flaw.
Faced with this situation a user can choose to either use the arrow keys in vim, or go full Stockholm syndrome and change the default in every other piece of software to match vim.
If that seems like a good idea, it might be worth remembering that the creator of vi didn't choose hjkl because he thought it superior to using arrow keys - he did it because the computer he used had no arrow keys! ;-)
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> unless your hand is glued to the resting keys It is, the hint is in the name! > even if it were the resting keys might not be hjkl So? Use the other resting keys, resting is key here, not their labels > even if they are they will by default type hjkl and not move the cursor in any other software you ever use except vim. Sorry, but your knowledge of the software world is too shallow, there are other apps that do tha…
>It is, the hint is in the name! Just about any line of text I write daily uses symbols not reachable from the resting position, and once my hand has left that position the arrow keys are easier to find. (Inverted T of course, with home/end/pgdown/pgup cluster). >there are other apps that do that, specifically, file managers The point is that you ("you" in this case being a typical user, not you personally) will open…
Use a better setup! No-one forces you to use bad defaults and think everything must be bad. Also, there are no such symbols even on standard setup, all of the number row keys/symbols are reachable with individual fingers, so you never miss the resting place, it's a couple of fingers moving back and forth.
> my hand has left that position the arrow keys are easier to find. (Inverted T of course, with home/end/pgdown/pgup cluster
It didn't, a couple of your fingers did. But also, why did you ignore the F6, numpad+ etc hand dance and only focus on the arrow keys?
> "you" in this case being a typical user
A typical user doesn't use vim. A real user using vim is perfectly capable of basic keyboard rebinding
> This is mental friction that remains even after you spent years internalizing the hjkl cursor moving flaw.
No, it goes away after you spend minutes oiling your system to remove friction. (Of course, it may still take years of ignorance before that...)
> change the default in every other piece of software to match vim.
Or you change the default once system-wide. See, reality is much simpler than your fantasy!
> the creator of vi didn't choose hjkl because he thought it superior
So? You're the only one here stuck on hjkl because for some reason you can't comprehend that it's just a config, not a mandatory commandment passed down by the Vim prophet.
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>It is, the hint is in the name! Just about any line of text I write daily uses symbols not reachable from the resting position, and once my hand has left that position the arrow keys are easier to find. (Inverted T of course, with home/end/pgdown/pgup cluster). >there are other apps that do that, specifically, file managers The point is that you ("you" in this case being a typical user, not you personally) will open…
> Just about any line of text I write daily uses symbols not reachable from the resting position Use a better setup! No-one forces you to use bad defaults and think everything must be bad. Also, there are no such symbols even on standard setup, all of the number row keys/symbols are reachable with individual fingers, so you never miss the resting place, it's a couple of fingers moving back and forth. > my hand has le…
Even if you only use your own computer, customizing the basics is a bit of a trap in many ways.
First you need to find a different setup that is actually better, not just different. Then you need to build muscle memory for it, then you need to never use any other computer because they will not have your setup.
I think getting good at using the defaults is better than changing the defaults. Basically learn to play the guitar, even if it's hard.
I customize things too, but take care to make it additive, not transformative. Aliases, plugins, better software and such are fine, but messing with my muscle memory is just not worth it.
>Also, there are no such symbols even on standard setup
That depends on the standard. In some countries you need two hands to type an @, just to take one example. For US english the numpad is a good example though. Not so easy to find the home keys from the numpad, but your hand passes the arrow keys on the way. :)
>why did you ignore the F6, numpad+ etc hand dance and only focus on the arrow keys?
Because I'm mainly making a counterpoint to your claim that using hjkl was better than using the arrow keys.
It has admittedly grown to a more general anti-bikeshedding rant fuelled by my own bikeshedding regrets - so I better stop here. :)
Earlier quoted context omitted.
> Just about any line of text I write daily uses symbols not reachable from the resting position Use a better setup! No-one forces you to use bad defaults and think everything must be bad. Also, there are no such symbols even on standard setup, all of the number row keys/symbols are reachable with individual fingers, so you never miss the resting place, it's a couple of fingers moving back and forth. > my hand has le…
>Use a better setup! Even if you only use your own computer, customizing the basics is a bit of a trap in many ways. First you need to find a different setup that is actually better, not just different. Then you need to build muscle memory for it, then you need to never use any other computer because they will not have your setup. I think getting good at using the defaults is better than changing the defaults. Basica…
Again, if you really had such a defeatist attitude to changing things you'd simply never vim, or the MC file manager for that matter because they're not available everywhere, and you need to avoid other computers etc. In reality all of this is false, of course, humans are flexible enough
> but messing with my muscle memory is just not worth it.
You don't have any muscle memory for F6. But also it's trivial for such common things as cursor keys alternatives, you ijkl is already an inverted T that your muscles are used to, just without the extra hand move
> That depends on the standard. In some countries you need two hands to type an @, just to take one example
Wrong again, you'd need two fingers, but your hands stay near their resting place.
> Because I'm mainly making a counterpoint to your claim that using hjkl was better than using the arrow keys.
You're the one who brought these keys up! My point was "Don't repeat the ancient hjkl mistake?", but then you couldn't argue with.
One of the most overlooked features is a custom user menu[1]. It allows greatly expanding MC's capabilities with custom actions and integrate it into specific workflows. No plugins or DSLs, just a `sh` calling whatever you like.
For example, I have a couple keybinds for transferring selected files/directories over rsync while browsing the remote directory over sftp. You can easily adapt it to do the same for directories mounted remotely with sshfs/rclone mount.
Another action that I like to add (this one I actually use in Double Commander on my GUI workstation) is to automatically convert transferred files on the fly, like compress media with ffmpeg (WAV to FLAC, * to OPUS, etc).
[1]: https://source.midnight-commander.org/man/mc.html#Edit_Menu_...