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Don't guess my language

vitonsky.net

311–320 of 392 posts

Re: Don't guess my language

#311
Could we also agree that bilingual (or more) people exist? I hate playing whack-a-mole with YouTube captions: Apparently me turning them off on English videos means I only speak English, so the next time I watch a German video, I'll have to turn off captions again, which apparently means I forgot English and only understand German.

I mean, doesn't Google have employees from multiple countries? Shouldn't diversity fix this in the sense that some bilingual person there notices this?

Re: Don't guess my language

#312

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> in alphabetical order Well, it's in an order, but I don't know about alphabetical. I clicked on today's English featured article and looked at the languages: "中文", "Italiano" are "suggested", then the remainder are grouped by geographic region, and aren't particularly alphabetical. They appear to be in groups which are still not alphabetical. Europe seems to have a Cyrillic group but "Қазақша" is shown after "Украї…

> The Chinese languages don't seem to be in stroke order (no expert here) They are for me. In the Asia section, 中文 ["Chinese"] is listed first, followed by 吴语 ["Wu"] and then 粤语 ["Cantonese"]. Stroke order is first by stroke count and then by an obscure criterion that I don't know (and that, in my experience, Chinese people living in China also don't know), but stroke count is unambiguous and these are in order: 中 4,…

It is sorted FIRST by radical and SECOND by stroke order. This is roughly equivalent to the Unicode codepoint sort if you stay in the basic multilingual plane. The order also puts literary chinese afer wu Chinese, which breaks with a pure stroke-count sort:

中文 - 中 = 丨 + 3 strokes

吴语 - 吴 = 口 + 4 strokes

文言 - 文 = 文 + 0 strokes

日本語 - 日 = 日 + 0 strokes

粵語 - 粵 = 米 + 7 strokes

Re: Don't guess my language

#313
One reason this happens: the product is slightly different in every country due to market and regulatory nuances. Therefore the source content is different in every country also. We are not going to push every (country, language) permutation through legal review. Therefore we have a few "Accept-Language" values we respect for each IP geolocation. If it's not on the list, you get the country's default.

Re: Don't guess my language

#315
post #307
post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This. Related: if I had a penny for every time I needed a VPN just to load the payment method selection screen (but not for the actual payment, it's not geolocked) just to be able to pay somewhere, I'd get a lot of products for free by now... Why not let germans select iDeal and dutch users Giropay? They'll not click it if it's not useful for them. Adjusting the sort for what's most commonly used makes sense, but why…

Because then companies would have to charge all users the same price for the exact same service. Charging customers from countries with higher average purchasing power more and hiding the fact behind "charging people in the local currency for convenience" is much more profitable!

I'm talking about those online stores that don't have a (customer hostile) thought out price for every locale, but they have some auto conversion.

When price is set to $9.99 which works out to 47.89287237634 in your local currency. Although it would work out to 45.89327782 if you used your bank's conversion instead of the "helpful" service.

In those cases i don't think the seller makes any extra money, they get their $9.99 minus payment processor's fees. They just think they're helpful but make you spend more for no good reason.

Re: Don't guess my language

#316
post #63

Not accepting Accept-Language is one of my major pet peeves. What makes it worse is that many multilingual websites translate their language-switching buttons and the list of languages to the current language .... which is beyond fucking stupid and defeats the purpose. Wikipedia does this right. The button to switch languages is clear, using a universal multilanguage icon, and a list of languages (using the name of t…

I can give a perfect bad example: the Youtube app on my iPhone somehow determined to change to Amharic. This is the Google support article: https://support.google.com/youtube/answer/87604 telling me the buttons to press in English. Also, I don't know/speak Amharic, and so at the time had no idea what language it was, and the iPhone translate doesn't even recognize this Ethiopian language. Bit of a pickle that could h…

Or the ChatGPT app which can be baffling. My phone language is English, I've set ChatGPT app specifically to English in the app settings, I ask my questions in English, and every now and then it still decides to answer in German.

Re: Don't guess my language

#317
post #305
post #194

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is wrong to blame the server here. For better results in content-negotiation, a user-agent should allow you to assign numeric weights instead of just a list (implying the same level of preference). Example: Accept-Language: en;q=0.7,pt;q=0.3 If you already send something similar to this, and the server gets it wrong, then this is an outright bug, the software or its operator is out of compliance with HTTP.

This parameter, at first glance, appears to be used as numeric weights for automatic translations served by default, what turns browsing very uncomfortable (wrong translations, distorted texts). Ie. Google, Youtube, Reddit. Automatic translations should never be served by default, but only be loaded if the user requests it. The classical "do you want translate".

It was and still is used for manually translated text, among other things. Does this help you get the full picture?

Re: Don't guess my language

#318
post #23

I also hate the youtube "feature" that translates the titles of videos to your setting's language. This is so annoying. I can understand English and don't need these automatic translations.

I mean, I can deal with the titles, but recently it has been auto selecting machine translated sound tracks, without any way to disable it. And they're bad, like maybe one level above 2010 phone TTS system

Re: Don't guess my language

#319
post #151

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not in the Czech alphabet: a, á, b, c, č, d, ď, e, é, ě, ... Also, we regard 'Ch' as its own letter. So yeah, try sorting alphabetically. I'll wait.

Digraphs like Ch are common in a lot of languages. Wikipedia supports that fine on category pages. E.g. https://cs.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kategorie:CHKO_%C5%A0umava If you want to see bizarre sort rules, look up how french sorts accent characters.

> If you want to see bizarre sort rules, look up how french sorts accent characters.

I tried to do this, but there do not appear to be any sources addressing this question.

I did find a French Stack Exchange question asking for this exact information, and complaining that there are no sources (other than an uncited wikipedia page) that address it. There is no answer posted, but there is a comment from a French guy suggesting that there are no official rules.

https://french.stackexchange.com/questions/54217/french-dict...

How were you imagining I would look this up?

Re: Don't guess my language

#320
post #63

Not accepting Accept-Language is one of my major pet peeves. What makes it worse is that many multilingual websites translate their language-switching buttons and the list of languages to the current language .... which is beyond fucking stupid and defeats the purpose. Wikipedia does this right. The button to switch languages is clear, using a universal multilanguage icon, and a list of languages (using the name of t…

99% agree, but there is a problem on mobile, to switch from Spanish to English when I click the glass to search for alternatives. I have to type "Ing" (that are the first letters of "Inglés") while it shows "English" in the list of matches. It would be better if I can type both "Ing" or "Eng".

I don't understand why you would want to select Inglés instead of English? You want to selecf English, or Español, or Nederlands, or Deutsch, or whatever language. If makes no sense for it to be translated.
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