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Starlink offering free internet access for 30 days for Hurricane Helene victims

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Re: Starlink offering free internet access for 30 days for Hurricane Helene victims

#311

Post by inemesitaffia »

seadan83 wrote: post #305
inemesitaffia wrote: post #295

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You aren't dismissing the scale. You're dismissing the entire effort. There's people with pack mules delivering aid. Including starlink receivers. Without collaboration with SpaceX

Please don't interpret what I'm writing as dismissing the entire relief effort. I am not, construing it as such is (I feel) willful misinterpretation. So let's back up and clarify. Before that, a more direct response to my question would have been appreciated too. I finally see you are responding mostly to: "Those in the cut off areas (via land transit) can't get the equipment anyways, and to boot any cost is a compl…

You're missing the SATCOM on TOW's and on the towers themselves.

The SMS you speak of were likely delivered over satellite(not necessarily starlink). A lot of sites with the transition to 4G don't have microwave backhaul anymore.

Re: Starlink offering free internet access for 30 days for Hurricane Helene victims

#312

Post by seadan83 »

inemesitaffia wrote: post #296
seadan83 wrote: post #289

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Asteroid stated earlier: "At worse this is nice gesture " I mostly wanted to correct that to say at worse it is a non gesture. Somewhat helping a couple hundred people out of a million plus, is not quite the "nice" gesture. Particularly a relatively poor population. IDK, a pedantic debate of "nice and meaningful" vs "nice but not significant" is not interesting. Non-gesture I would equate to the latter. It is not lik…

The devices were in immediately the storm passed. Not X days later. The people who brought them in are the ones who asked for it because they have activation issues. The world and Asheville doesn't exist only for you. And as I've pointed out a lot of those towers are backhauled over starlink. They could very well have received those texts over it before fiber was restored. Even today, days later, there's people askin…

> The devices were in immediately the storm passed

Fema currently only has 40 in. (Citation in another comment, kindly take my word for it). Do you know how many immediately afterwards, any data or evidence? Even wild ass guess?

> The world and Asheville doesn't exist only for you.

This sounds like your own bias and frustration and assumptions. I'll respond to the insult by asking we calm down and have dialogue. This is not twitter.

> a lot of those towers are backhauled over starlink.

Do you have more information on this? How many? Which ones? Do I have starlink to thank for enabling SMS to waynesville?

> They could very well have received those texts over it before fiber was restored.

This is speculation. Can we firm up this claim?

Re: Starlink offering free internet access for 30 days for Hurricane Helene victims

#313

Post by jmb99 »

happyraul wrote: post #268
jmb99 wrote: post #248

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can buy a used diesel/propane/gas/pick your fuel generator today for a few hundred bucks that could power most of the essentials in my house. I bought a brand new one during an extended power outage due to storms last year for $500 CAD. That and 80L of gas (~$120 CAD) can run my sump pumps, fridge, freezer, the electronic side of my furnace, my homelab server rack (including 6 PoE access points), my workstation, an…

The solar and batteries have much lower emissions, and can be used as all times (not just during power outages) to lower the cost of electricity. Anyway it doesn't have to be generator or solar + batteries... Why not both? Have the solar, reduce emissions and utility bills. Have the generator as a backup if power is out and batteries are empty.

That's what I'm currently in the planning phases for. Break-even is still the better part of a decade on parts alone, unless you get very creative (for instance, where I live, I can choose to have a special time-of-use electrical billing program where overnight electricity is ~60% cheaper than usual; you can make use of this to charge batteries overnight, rely on solar when it's sunny, and batteries during the more expensive times-of-use).

The overall point though, is that solar and/or batteries are not a viable alternative for emergency backup power, nor will they be "within the next few years." Within the next few decades, maybe.

Re: Starlink offering free internet access for 30 days for Hurricane Helene victims

#314

Post by seadan83 »

astroid wrote: post #307
svnt wrote: post #283

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ok, I went and looked and the free 30-day trial was already in place weeks before the natural disaster: https://www.cnet.com/home/internet/starlink-internet-review/ They didn’t do anything but offer the same deal they would to anyone else.

Oh wow quite the own. You really did something there. Do you mind demonstrating how you can unpackage the device and connect straight to the internet without going through the activation hurdles? If not, this is the most irrelevant piece of information you could possibly use to make your misguided point. First responders on their own volition brought StarLink terminals on site, which REQUIRE ACTIVATION regardless of…

Calm down Astroid please. You make good points, except the vitriol is very noisy. You can make those same points in half the text and without being mean.

Re: Starlink offering free internet access for 30 days for Hurricane Helene victims

#315

Post by seadan83 »

inemesitaffia wrote: post #297
svnt wrote: post #283

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ok, I went and looked and the free 30-day trial was already in place weeks before the natural disaster: https://www.cnet.com/home/internet/starlink-internet-review/ They didn’t do anything but offer the same deal they would to anyone else.

You don't know what you're talking about because you're not familiar with the service. That's a 30 day trial where you pay for the product and service in full and get a full refund if you don't like it. It's nothing like what's being offered right now where people are complaining about activation issues and the service just works. Usually you get an hour free on new devices. Now it's 30 days

Your response here would have been stronger had you skipped the first paragraph, a shallow dismissal. Calm down.

Details on the differences is illuminating, the "you don't know what you are talking about" is unhelpful.

Re: Starlink offering free internet access for 30 days for Hurricane Helene victims

#316

Post by astroid »

seadan83 wrote: post #309
astroid wrote: post #304

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Asteroid stated earlier: "At worse this is nice gesture " I mostly wanted to correct that to say at worse it is a non gesture. Somewhat helping a couple hundred people out of a million plus, is not quite the "nice" gesture. Yeah no correction needed here buddy - I get it you have anti-Elon syndrome and anything any of his companies do are bad, and you have decided to use your intellectual prowess to delude yourself i…

Not accepting claims is different from anti elon bias. You say X is good or bad, my response is prove it. You say X is meaningful, I have the same response. That is not being upset, it is being skeptical. With that said, I now concede there is more than marginal utility happening and I've done the numbers in sibling comments. The fact I've evolved my opinion based on further information I think makes most of your scr…

"You say X is good or bad, my response is provd it. You say X is meaningful, I have the same response." - No I didn't. Your bias is showing again.

"Are you referring to FEMA? Since there is at least one cajun navy style person who requested this that I am aware of, I would largely agree."

No - I am referring to the on the ground actual FIRST responders who were there helping immediately (and continue to volunteer their time, money, and skills) -- not the government agency that came in after. Are the only first responders that matter FEMA? Is this supposed to be some kind of logical fallacy gotcha like "OOOHHHHHHhhhhhh that dude that bought 50 StarLinks on his own credit card and hauled them out to those in need is actually SECOND to respond, doesn't matter if FEMA didn't help those people yet FEMA First, FEMA best." I know off-hand of a handful of volunteers that got over a hundred terminals out -- that could easily make a tangible difference for 1,000s of people alone. I'm sure there are many many more I don't have direct knowledge of.

You literally just fake quoted things I never said, misconstrued what I did say, laid out several logical traps, and somehow smugly think that everyone does not see through you.

"Every claim?" Yep.

Will I continue to dissect your disingenuous points? Nope, my time is more valuable than yours - and it's clear you have no problem pissing yours away to waste mine.

Yeah no thanks, I will patiently await your totally non-biased post-mortem-analysis of the data. Until then I have nothing more to say other than I feel sorry for you.

Re: Starlink offering free internet access for 30 days for Hurricane Helene victims

#317

Post by astroid »

seadan83 wrote: post #314
astroid wrote: post #307

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Oh wow quite the own. You really did something there. Do you mind demonstrating how you can unpackage the device and connect straight to the internet without going through the activation hurdles? If not, this is the most irrelevant piece of information you could possibly use to make your misguided point. First responders on their own volition brought StarLink terminals on site, which REQUIRE ACTIVATION regardless of…

Calm down Astroid please. You make good points, except the vitriol is very noisy. You can make those same points in half the text and without being mean.

Maybe stop cyber-stalking me if you don't like what I have to say?

Re: Starlink offering free internet access for 30 days for Hurricane Helene victims

#318

Post by [deleted] »

seadan83 wrote: post #309
astroid wrote: post #304

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Asteroid stated earlier: "At worse this is nice gesture " I mostly wanted to correct that to say at worse it is a non gesture. Somewhat helping a couple hundred people out of a million plus, is not quite the "nice" gesture. Yeah no correction needed here buddy - I get it you have anti-Elon syndrome and anything any of his companies do are bad, and you have decided to use your intellectual prowess to delude yourself i…

Not accepting claims is different from anti elon bias. You say X is good or bad, my response is prove it. You say X is meaningful, I have the same response. That is not being upset, it is being skeptical. With that said, I now concede there is more than marginal utility happening and I've done the numbers in sibling comments. The fact I've evolved my opinion based on further information I think makes most of your scr…

[deleted]

Re: Starlink offering free internet access for 30 days for Hurricane Helene victims

#319

Post by seadan83 »

astroid wrote: post #310
seadan83 wrote: post #235

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Blame Congress. (1) they control budget and can add the additional funds. They also know that half a billion is being "diverted" from acute disaster relief. The budgeting is on them. (2) Congress needsto amend the asylum law to allow asylum claims at ports of entry or not at all. That congress has a law disallowing asylum claims at ports of entry is why people are crossing deserts and then surrendering to the first a…

There is plenty of blame to go around, and Congress is certainly at the top of that list. It's a pretty long list though. Zero sum or not, the attitude you have about budget discussions is why we are about to print ourselves into a depression. If you can't discuss prioritizing spending based on whatever criteria applies to the situation, you simply can't discuss budget concerns. I do not take the view that the budget…

> Zero sum or not, the attitude you have about budget discussions is why we are about to print ourselves into a depression.

I'll ignore (beyond pointing it out here) that you are putting words into my mouth and conducting a personal attack.

I did mostly want to draw contrast that government budget is unlike household and not zero sum.

Whether we print ourselves into depression is unclear. Particularly since there are other levers and continues to be economic growth.

I agree spending cannot be 100% for every need.

> I have no problem evaluating it from the perspective of 'money is not infinite, and no specific agencies spending is so inherently special that it can not be discussed under the context of where potential waste or inefficient spending happened, and how it can be adjusted to avoid that in the future."

I agree. Though saying we should not spend anything on X until we spend all on Y is not the same as saying we are spending too much X (in part given that we need to spend on Y)

Re: Starlink offering free internet access for 30 days for Hurricane Helene victims

#320

Post by seadan83 »

astroid wrote: post #317
seadan83 wrote: post #314

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Calm down Astroid please. You make good points, except the vitriol is very noisy. You can make those same points in half the text and without being mean.

Maybe stop cyber-stalking me if you don't like what I have to say?

It seems there is just a half dozen of us in the same thread now :)

What you're saying has value and interest, but the delivery is violating the discussion guidelines and heading into the vitriol territory.

I suspect a mod might have shadow banned a chunk of this thread now, and if not, probably should.

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