'The big problem is water': UK ebike owners plagued by failing motors • Hacker News Board

Re: 'The big problem is water': UK ebike owners plagued by failing motors

#311

Post by hi-v-rocknroll » Mon, Jun 17, 2024, 4:14 PM UTC

yabatopia wrote: post #83

hi-v-rocknroll wrote: post #29

If it's a Chinese e-bike, it's probably lying about being IPX67. OTOH, Riese & Müller $15k USD e-bikes aren't IPX anything because the Bosch components aren't. If you get it wet, just kiss that money goodbye. Absolutely bonkers.

Huh, that’s not my experience. My wife rides to work on her R&M e-bike, every working day, all year round, in sun, rain or snow. Daily distance is about 40km (25 miles), two hours back and forth. Not a single major problem caused by water in more than 5 years.

They don't mention any specific IPX rating, however they claim it's "rain resistant".

https://www.r-m.de/en-us/service/faq/

Yes. You can use the system in the rain without any concerns. It is protected against rain and splashes, but not against riding through rivers when the motor is submerged in water.

Equivalent of about IPX54. To me, this means it's not really waterproof (IPX?7) should it fall a puddle when it rains. Never spray it with a garden hose or pressure washer while washing. And, it's really a gamble to take it in the rain. Plus, like cell phones, they tend to lose IPX protection when repaired because of customary sloppy repair jobs that fail to restore gaskets.

Re: 'The big problem is water': UK ebike owners plagued by failing motors

#312

Post by hi-v-rocknroll » Mon, Jun 17, 2024, 4:15 PM UTC

janandonly wrote: post #169

hi-v-rocknroll wrote: post #29

If it's a Chinese e-bike, it's probably lying about being IPX67. OTOH, Riese & Müller $15k USD e-bikes aren't IPX anything because the Bosch components aren't. If you get it wet, just kiss that money goodbye. Absolutely bonkers.

$15K ??? I’m just checking their website. If you buy a “Culture Touring” e-bike from Riese & Müller you pay about €4K. That is still a lot of money. But not nearly as much as $15K. Link: https://www.r-m.de/nl/bikes/culture/

That's your costs where you are. That's not what they cost where I am. https://electricavenuebike.com/store/riese-muller-load-75-ro...

Re: 'The big problem is water': UK ebike owners plagued by failing motors

#313

Post by hi-v-rocknroll » Mon, Jun 17, 2024, 4:20 PM UTC

ARandomerDude wrote: post #130

hi-v-rocknroll wrote: post #29

If it's a Chinese e-bike, it's probably lying about being IPX67. OTOH, Riese & Müller $15k USD e-bikes aren't IPX anything because the Bosch components aren't. If you get it wet, just kiss that money goodbye. Absolutely bonkers.

Serious question, why would a person spend that kind of money on an ebike? An entry-level motorcycle is less than half that. What benefit does the bike get you that a motorcycle doesn't? One example among many: https://powersports.honda.com/motorcycle/cruiser/rebel-500

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

It's a stupid amount of money for what it is.

KTM makes an 18 kW e-motorcycle for $12k USD.

https://www.ktm.com/en-us/models/e-ride/freeride/2023-ktm-fr...

Re: 'The big problem is water': UK ebike owners plagued by failing motors

#314

Post by hi-v-rocknroll » Mon, Jun 17, 2024, 4:24 PM UTC

IshKebab wrote: post #155

Too wrote: post #151

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Convenience and sense of freedom. No license required, can lend it to friends or kids. Can be parked anywhere. Can be loaded on a car, ferry and some places even the metro. Can ride them on bike lanes, the forest and the sidewalk. More approachable diy maintenance. Don't need full leather protection, just a helmet and t-shirt and you are good to go. If you are only traveling max 30km within the town, you don't need a…

> Can be parked anywhere Jesus I wouldn't park a $15k bike anywhere...

Some bicyclists in Palo Alto do, probably because they can't take their Ferrari's with them. A former business partner had a ~$8k bicycle stolen from Castro St. downtown in a very public area. All it takes to steal is 30 seconds and a battery-powered angle grinder. If someone doesn't have Tile, AirTag, and a GPS tracker on such a bike, then they're an idiot.

Re: 'The big problem is water': UK ebike owners plagued by failing motors

#315

Post by hi-v-rocknroll » Mon, Jun 17, 2024, 4:27 PM UTC

IshKebab wrote: post #294

macrolime wrote: post #256

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you're afraid of it getting stolen you can buy insurance.

"Hi, I'd like to insure my $15k ebike. How many times has it been stolen you ask? Oh only a few. Half a dozen at most. Hello? Is anyone there?"

Hahaha. I hope a precondition to any bicycle theft includes requires 1 or more tracking devices and not transiting anywhere near a major metropolitan area or any city area with a drug problem.

Re: 'The big problem is water': UK ebike owners plagued by failing motors

#316

Post by hi-v-rocknroll » Mon, Jun 17, 2024, 4:31 PM UTC

nox101 wrote: post #159

ARandomerDude wrote: post #130

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Serious question, why would a person spend that kind of money on an ebike? An entry-level motorcycle is less than half that. What benefit does the bike get you that a motorcycle doesn't? One example among many: https://powersports.honda.com/motorcycle/cruiser/rebel-500

I'm curious too when bikes became that expensive. I just recently started looking for a new bike. Every major bike brand (Specialized, Trek, Cannondale, Orbea, Canyon, Santa Cruz, etc...) all sell bikes between $4000 an $18000! That's regardless of whether they are e-bikes or non-e-bikes. When did bikes get that expensive? I bought a "brand name bike" just like 6 years ago for $900 and thought I was going way out of…

E-bikes imported to the US from Europe for sale to Americans who have essentially unlimited funds and little concern for what things actually cost.

For mechanical bikes, they've always been (relatively) expensive. Here's one for $16k: https://www.cannondale.com/en-us/bikes/road/race/supersix-ev...

Re: 'The big problem is water': UK ebike owners plagued by failing motors

#317

Post by hi-v-rocknroll » Mon, Jun 17, 2024, 4:36 PM UTC

macrolime wrote: post #255

ARandomerDude wrote: post #130

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Serious question, why would a person spend that kind of money on an ebike? An entry-level motorcycle is less than half that. What benefit does the bike get you that a motorcycle doesn't? One example among many: https://powersports.honda.com/motorcycle/cruiser/rebel-500

With an ebike you can ride in bike lanes, sidewalks and many other places motorcycles are not allowed. They can also park loads of places motorcycles aren't allowed plus you get exercise.

Yep. Ebikes can do a lot of things motorcycles aren't allowed to do. For example, it's customary (while illegal) for ebikes to not stop at stop signs in the US because there's little-to-no enforcement of it compared to the enforcement of traffic laws against motorcyclists.

Re: 'The big problem is water': UK ebike owners plagued by failing motors

#318

Post by janandonly » Mon, Jun 17, 2024, 4:56 PM UTC

hi-v-rocknroll wrote: post #312

janandonly wrote: post #169

Earlier quoted context omitted.

$15K ??? I’m just checking their website. If you buy a “Culture Touring” e-bike from Riese & Müller you pay about €4K. That is still a lot of money. But not nearly as much as $15K. Link: https://www.r-m.de/nl/bikes/culture/

That's your costs where you are . That's not what they cost where I am. https://electricavenuebike.com/store/riese-muller-load-75-ro...

Yes. I was trying to make a point an out absurt price differentiation based on location.

Re: 'The big problem is water': UK ebike owners plagued by failing motors

#319

Post by hi-v-rocknroll » Mon, Jun 17, 2024, 5:03 PM UTC

janandonly wrote: post #318

hi-v-rocknroll wrote: post #312

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's your costs where you are . That's not what they cost where I am. https://electricavenuebike.com/store/riese-muller-load-75-ro...

Yes. I was trying to make a point an out absurt price differentiation based on location.

Buy lots there and arbitrage them here. ;) (Might not work because of the warranty arrangements.)

Also, it appears a subset of Americans have way, way too much money and are begging to be relieved of this burden.

Re: 'The big problem is water': UK ebike owners plagued by failing motors

#320

Post by jjav » Mon, Jun 17, 2024, 7:20 PM UTC

blacksmith_tb wrote: post #104

Etheryte wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're glossing over the fact that internal gear hub transmissions easily cost in the hundreds, whereas you can get a derailleur for a tenner or so. I've owned a number of bikes in my life and all of them have been cheaper than the transmission you suggest everyone should use.

There's a lot of range in internally-geared hubs though, from the crazy end with the $1500 Rohloff 14sp to the $80 Sturmey-Archer 3sp. I commute on a Shimano Alfine 11sp that's ~$200 which isn't exactly "a tenner" but if you add up the price of a derailleur, cassette, chainrings, etc. I don't think it's much different?

This is one area where I've found that paying for quality up front can be a cost saving and certainly a time saver.

We have lots of bikes and have gone through even more (bought & sold). The most reliable drivetrain on any of them just turned 20 (2004 model). It was the highest end Shimano XT-R at the time. It is easy to align, always stays in alignment, all in all takes very little attention and always shifts perfectly.

The bikes with cheaper drivetrains are a lot fuzzier and take more frequent attention and even when freshly aligned don't quite shift as nicely.

The absolute worst is the cheapest one (a department store bike my partner insisted on buying as an exercise bike). It simply can't be aligned well no matter how many hours spent. When I get it to a good-enough state, it's misaligned after a few weeks. The amount of time wasted on that thing would easily buy at least an Ultegra set to replace it.