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End of the Line? Saudi Arabia to scale back plans for desert megacity

theguardian.com

311–320 of 448 posts

Re: End of the Line? Saudi Arabia to scale back plans for desert megacity

#311
post #121

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not like they have another option, have they? It's an interesting challenge to transform an uninhabitable piece of earth into something where people might want to live. Also, AFAIK they are very aware that oil money isn't going to keep pouring forever and they indeed are trying to diversify. Their elites all study in UK, France, Switzerland and the USA and the questionable stuff they do is actually about the loc…

Sure, they could put money in education, research climate change and photovoltaic or other technologies and try to improve quality of life with sustainable stuff. But to the people in power, only symbols and power are important.

> But to the people in power, only symbols and power are important.

A general statement that is universal across time and geography. Nothing special about the gulf

Re: End of the Line? Saudi Arabia to scale back plans for desert megacity

#312

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Uh no. Republicans control the House which is enough to prevent even $1 from being spent or sent anywhere. https://www.perplexity.ai/search/What-are-some-yxB.yA2.SzS7M... There’s not some big mystery here. Democrats are proposing bill after bill after bill, and republicans are loudly and proudly blocking them.

Is it the House who refused to send 20+ years old heavy weapons to Ukraine since 2022?

We did send huge amounts of aid in 2022, including 38 HIMARS, 2,000 Stingers, 100,000 anti-armor systems, 250 artillery guns, 9,000 anti-tank missiles, and 35,000 small arms.

Then Republicans put a hard right Christian theocrat, who’s totally captured by the hard-right wing of the party, in charge of the House and everything has stalled.

Re: End of the Line? Saudi Arabia to scale back plans for desert megacity

#313
post #204

Earlier quoted context omitted.

With the caveat that all published "plans" for the thing were probably meant as a PR stunt the plan called for passively cooling it[1]. That part actually doesn't seem implausible, it's right on the Red Sea, which is quite hot on the surface, but cools down as you you go deeper into it[2]. So (and this is just my speculation) they could have a large undersea pipeline to a depth of say 1km, and use the heat the buildi…

How are we pumping the water if the power is out? I guess they're would be diesel generators for that in reality. We need an engineer to calculate the flow needed because given how far away the far end is from the water that could end up behind one huge generator, not to mention the size of the pipes. It's worth mentioning that they don't seem to be burying any massive water pipes so this isn't likely to be done in r…

We also have humans in space at the moment. Normally the answer would be fault tolerance or similar engineering solutions.

Furthermore, if the building is decently isolated (HR++ sun-blocking glass exists), it should be able to handle some air conditioning downtime.

Re: End of the Line? Saudi Arabia to scale back plans for desert megacity

#314

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Will the world's criminals start storing their money there or did you mean something else with Switzerland of the Middle East?

Start? Uae is a place known for storing and moving shady money. Very few extradition treatys.

Uk is the world’s money laundering capital of the world

Re: End of the Line? Saudi Arabia to scale back plans for desert megacity

#315

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Clearly you dislike gulf countries. I'll be frank: I have a deep mistrust of any culture present in the Arabian peninsula since about 632 CE.

Could it be racism?

No. It's neither about race nor ethnicity; it's about culture and religion. It's not about the people, either, since the differences from person to person are as pronounced there as everywhere. It is, though, about the society built with the culture in question as a foundation. You can criticize societies everywhere, starting from your own - it's normal, healthy, and has nothing to do with racism.

Re: End of the Line? Saudi Arabia to scale back plans for desert megacity

#316
post #243

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You should be worried about gay rights: some years ago, a French teenage boy was raped by some local men, and the authorities initially tried to get the boy to confess. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gang_rape has some more examples.

Which country are you talking about?

UAE, obviously, since I was replying to your comment saying you weren't concerned with gay rights in UAE.

Re: End of the Line? Saudi Arabia to scale back plans for desert megacity

#317
post #177

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not to mention literal modern day slavery where they bring in South Asians on the promise of better pay, then take away their passports and pay them pennies.

How Qatar built the stadiums for the World Cup? Well, like this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UMqLDhl8PXw

Disclaimer: Qatar is a terrible place when it comes to treatment of migrant workers. The following is not meant as a defense of Qatar. It is meant to correct one particular thing that most reporting gets wrong.

The part where it talks about 6500 migrant worker deaths over the decade of World Cup facility construction has a serious error. It fails to look at the death rate.

Qatar has around 2 million migrant workers, and the 6500 deaths are all deaths of migrants in the country rather than just work related deaths. 6500 deaths over 10 years in a population of 2 million is a death rate of 32.5/100k/year.

A death rate of 32.5/100k/year should raise questions, especially if we assume that migrant workers in Qatar skew younger, but the question should be why is it so low?

For comparison the death rate for 15-24 year old males in the US is 100/100k/year, and for 25-34 year old males it is 177/100k/year.

It's possible that Qatar's poor treatment of migrant workers does result in an unusually high job-related death rate but something else Qatar does results in an unusually low death rate when not at work with the net result being the overall death rate is low.

In the US the top causes of death of young males are poisoning (which includes drug overdoses), suicide, automobile accidents, and homicide.

Qatar is very anti-drug, with harsh penalties and almost no tolerance, giving them a drug death rate around 4% of the US drug death rate.

They are also much more intolerant of drunk driving, which is a major contributor to automobile deaths in the US. In Qatar if there is any detectable alcohol in your blood after an accident you are considered to have been drunk driving. That threshold is so low that you would be considered drunk if you were in an accident in the morning and had one drink the night before. Also I'd expect that most migrant workers use some other form of transport most of the time.

Their homicide rate is also very low.

Are those enough to offset a high work-related death rate. I don't know. I should know because all of the articles I've seen talking about migrant worker deaths in Qatar should have looked into this.

Re: End of the Line? Saudi Arabia to scale back plans for desert megacity

#318

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why so harsh example? This one is better: a woman in UAE went to the doctor(gynecologist) and ended up in jail because doctor found out she is pregnant but not married.

In America a black man driving a clean car can be pulled over and shot dead by police In many American states a raped woman has to carry her rapist off spring to term In America black people are significantly over represented in jails, poverty, illiteracy, single parent families. I’m sure the 5 largest western democracies have similar issues

Are there special laws for black people? no, it is not comparable with UAE.

Re: End of the Line? Saudi Arabia to scale back plans for desert megacity

#319
There are two types of such big projects out there.

There are those grandiose mega projects purely for the rich, purely for vanity and showing off wealth and meant attract outside attention... like "The Line" for example...

...but there also are more sensible projects, that are actually meant to help the local populace, improve conditions, and fight poverty... like "The Al Baydha Project" just for one example.

It's totally possible to do something ambitious and impressive, and with historic significance without becoming completely detached from reality.

Re: End of the Line? Saudi Arabia to scale back plans for desert megacity

#320
post #238

I want to see someone seriously analyze what would happen if there was a power loss to the Line. Hundreds of thousands of people in a glass box in 50C weather with no AC sounds like a recipe for a record breaking mass casualty event.

The analysis is that the rich will escape using their multicopters, as for the mass of undocumented immigrants , it was the will of god

Even Burning Man is bigger and wierder over there!
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