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Spain lives in flats: why we have built our cities vertically

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Re: Spain lives in flats: why we have built our cities vertically

#311

Post by Barrin92 »

jjav wrote: post #296
SkeuomorphicBee wrote: post #154

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Different strokes indeed. As a very happy apartment/flat/condo dweller, the suburban home life feels to me like being trapped in a tiny deserted island (the cartoon ones, with a single coconut tree), just a tiny personal plot surrounded by endless nothingness, with nowhere to go within reach. When in the suburbs I end up just staying in the couch all the time, because I can't be bothered to face the big journey neces…

> As a very happy apartment/flat/condo dweller, the suburban home life feels to me like being trapped in a tiny deserted island (the cartoon ones, with a single coconut tree), just a tiny personal plot surrounded by endless nothingness, with nowhere to go within reach. When in the suburbs I end up just staying in the couch all the time, because I can't be bothered to face the big journey necessary to go places, feels…

> Can you point at actual suburbs

Not the OP but when I lived in the US as an exchange student I lived in a suburb that looked exactly like the one in this video[1], which seems to be a fairly typical middle class neighborhood.

Like him I had the same experience of barely being able to walk anywhere, given how little space there even is for pedestrians.

[1]https://youtu.be/39QOw4IL0Gk?t=509

Re: Spain lives in flats: why we have built our cities vertically

#312

Post by bluGill »

ZoomerCretin wrote: post #277
Karrot_Kream wrote: post #254

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problem is that while the shape of single-family home suburbs are meticulously controlled (e.g. minimum width between each house, minimum width from the street to your home), the world of apartments are conversely very lightly regulated. California building codes added an optional appendix for noiseproofing standards for multi-family units that cities can opt-into and yet the cities with some of the strictest/mos…

> California building codes added an optional appendix for noiseproofing standards for multi-family units that cities can opt-into and yet the cities with some of the strictest/most expansive SFH zoning in the Bay Area refuse to opt into this standard. Why am I not surprised? This is why we need more city council members who rent. Renter issues are completely invisible to those holding political power.

Renters are generally much less likely to vote and so their issues get less attention.

Re: Spain lives in flats: why we have built our cities vertically

#313

Post by rangestransform »

avgcorrection wrote: post #156
2-718-281-828 wrote: post #142

Earlier quoted context omitted.

you don't like old folks?

Contemporary societal culture is biased against old folks—little respect, not valued for their wisdom and experience—but the problem with more older people is higher costs for retirement, healthcare, and a smaller pool of tax payers.

nope, a recent example is the covid19 pandemic response

Re: Spain lives in flats: why we have built our cities vertically

#314

Post by jeffbee »

whalesalad wrote: post #303
kdmccormick wrote: post #299

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It means that when you look at government revenue vs expenditure per square mile, urban dwellers are massively subsidizing surburbanites. It's mainly because maintainence of roads, parking, and utilities for a spread-out surburbia is vastly less efficient than it is for a tightly packed city.

We all pay taxes, I don't see an issue. I pay significantly more taxes than people who are living in more affordable/dense housing in the city - both in property taxes as well as the fact that I earn a higher income. I am subsidizing lots of other people in my community.

There are loads of people who believe this but who are mistaken. Typically they are underestimating the value of services delivered to them for free at the point of use. We don't know your individual situation of course, but it's true in the aggregate.

Re: Spain lives in flats: why we have built our cities vertically

#315

Post by Narishma »

wackget wrote: post #268
spaintech wrote: post #73

What a fantastic site! Wish more titea were build this way. It was an awesome experience! I’m an outsider living in Spain for the last 22 years, I think that while the content portrays a reality of the high rise movement in Spain, there is an angle that was missed. It is important to say that the at time draconian land laws pay an important role in the urban landscape. Not to mention that Spain relative young democra…

Unpopular opinion but I hate the design of the site. The transitions are too slow and the entire site is inaccessible to anyone with vertigo, visual processing or balance disorders. Needless to say it also doesn't respect the browser's `prefers-reduced-motion` preference. A massive case of style over substance for me.

Agreed.

Another downside is that it consumes huge amounts of memory.

Re: Spain lives in flats: why we have built our cities vertically

#316

Post by Earw0rm »

Vinnl wrote: post #72

What's interesting is that the Netherlands is pretty low on the list of countries with the highest percentage of people in collective dwellings (at 21% vs Spain's 65%, only the UK is lower), even though it's one of the most densely populated countries in Europe. I suppose that's the result of the mentioned "mushroom neighbourhoods"? Great visuals btw.

Smaller plots of land, also. UK family homes (at least until the 70s or so) tend to have large gardens, Dutch seem to have less private outdoor space but put more effort into making the street-scene nice in residential areas, which UK is terrible at.

On the flip-side, the Dutch attitude to their countryside (or let's say, non urban land) is pretty brutal outside of the national parks. There's not the fetishization of "country" living that you get in the UK.

Re: Spain lives in flats: why we have built our cities vertically

#318

Post by bombcar »

balfirevic wrote: post #253
davidw wrote: post #145

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not sure about Spain, but in Italy, you definitely find a lot of 'family size' flats. We had a 3-bedroom, 2-bathroom flat in a 6-plex, and that is a pretty common sort of living arrangement.

What's the area of those flats? Where I live there are plenty of 3 bedroom flats, but they are usually under 100 m^2 (often smaller) and almost always under 150 m^2. 3 bedrooms in 100 m^2 is pretty cramped.

100 sq meters is about 1000 sq ft, and that's definitely on the small side for a 3 bedroom. 150 at 1600 is much more "normal" even in the US (for apartments, houses are usually bigger now).

Re: Spain lives in flats: why we have built our cities vertically

#319

Post by elric »

mupuff1234 wrote: post #77

I find the ideal building height to be up to 6 floors at most - anything more makes the streets start to feel a bit too claustrophobic and the area less "neighborly".

~6 floors is sometimes referred to as the goldilocks zone of building density. Treehugger has some good articles on it [1]. Horizontal navigation is much easier than vertical navigation (gravity and all that). Having a bunch of ~6 floor buildings next to each other makes for great walkability, while still allowing for ample daylight (and trees and whatnot), without attracing the windy conditions of all towers.

[1] https://www.treehugger.com/search?q=goldilocks

Re: Spain lives in flats: why we have built our cities vertically

#320

Post by j-a-a-p »

nologic01 wrote: post #134

Excellent storytelling, fluidly integrating geospatial data and other visual elements and statistics in a smooth flow. Who knows, maybe one day such a "visual space" inside a browser would be interactive, a Google Earth type of thing as far as navigation goes, but with data queries that allow on the fly to populate various widgets. An expert could livestream a story or "save" it for later publication.

The New York Times regularly have this flowing style of stories. It is often quite impressive. Once they did a simple flowless scroll type of story called 78 long minutes, about a scared police force during a school shooting. Very impressive, you keep thinking do something! while reading and scrolling.

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2022/05/28/us/school-sho...

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