I’m not familiar with the bill and specifics, does anyone know if it improved access to rehabilitation if sought?
Oregon decriminalized hard drugs – early results aren’t encouraging
311–320 of 1001 posts
Re: Oregon decriminalized hard drugs – early results aren’t encouraging
#312I used to strongly support making drugs legal. I thought: this is a free country, you should be able to do what you want. But what I've seen in San Francisco has made me think differently. Most people who use drugs eventually end up not being able to live like normal adults. And no one willingly goes to get help or treatment. The problem will stick around because politicians care more about how things look. They'll s…
> Does anyone have ideas on what we should do?
Heathcare facilities for the mentally ill is a really good start.
But, you know, that's, like, expensive.
Re: Oregon decriminalized hard drugs – early results aren’t encouraging
#313I used to strongly support making drugs legal. I thought: this is a free country, you should be able to do what you want. But what I've seen in San Francisco has made me think differently. Most people who use drugs eventually end up not being able to live like normal adults. And no one willingly goes to get help or treatment. The problem will stick around because politicians care more about how things look. They'll s…
Part of the problem frankly is that not all drugs are created equal.
There's very little reason for opioids to be freely available.
But weed, psychadelics, mdma, etc. why not?
Re: Oregon decriminalized hard drugs – early results aren’t encouraging
#314I used to strongly support making drugs legal. I thought: this is a free country, you should be able to do what you want. But what I've seen in San Francisco has made me think differently. Most people who use drugs eventually end up not being able to live like normal adults. And no one willingly goes to get help or treatment. The problem will stick around because politicians care more about how things look. They'll s…
I think the lessons are there in what Portugal has done with their insane heroin wave (it was reported that 1 entire percent of the population was reported to have an addiction to hard drugs).
The parallels in Van, SF and Portland are striking, except now it’s not Heroin it’s Fentanyl.
Here’s a good primer: https://www.cbc.ca/news2/interactives/portugal-heroin-decrim...
Re: Oregon decriminalized hard drugs – early results aren’t encouraging
#315Rubbish. Folks made the exact same arguments about alcohol and marijuana. Specifically with alcohol, anyone can walk into a treatment center without fear that they'll be arrested for the mere _use_ of a substance. (Marijuana has very low risk and rates of addiction, physical or psychological.) If "hard" drugs are legalized, then they will likely be treated the same as alcohol and pot and tobacco: highly regulated, so…
I think another big mistake was prescription painkillers and that whole story. Get everyone hooked on cheap low grade painkillers, it definitely caused problems but they were manageable if they got more pills. Then there was a huge crackdown on them, and the price shot up ending with fentanyl being the cheap and accessible option.
Re: Oregon decriminalized hard drugs – early results aren’t encouraging
#316Earlier quoted context omitted.
This is definitely part of the answer. Walking through the streets of San Francisco a while ago with my kids I was shocked to see people just lying on the side walk in pools of their own vomit. Also was very protective of my kids walking past people that were obviously on drugs and out of their minds. These people became not so much people but just a threat. It seemed inhumane to just leave them like that. With that…
What did you do to help these people who were suffering? Did you just glare and step over them?
Yes. What would you like me to do? Walk up to each one I came across, my little kids in tow and try to have an intelligent conversation with them? Give them all my money? Invite them back with me to my hotel like the pied Piper of addicts?
I want them out of the way and far away from my kids. I was pretty clear that I perceived them as a threat.
Re: Oregon decriminalized hard drugs – early results aren’t encouraging
#317Rubbish. Folks made the exact same arguments about alcohol and marijuana. Specifically with alcohol, anyone can walk into a treatment center without fear that they'll be arrested for the mere _use_ of a substance. (Marijuana has very low risk and rates of addiction, physical or psychological.) If "hard" drugs are legalized, then they will likely be treated the same as alcohol and pot and tobacco: highly regulated, so…
I think you should contribute a valid source for the subjective claim of this statement.
"Marijuana has very low risk and rates of addiction, physical or psychological."
I would, and that is not based on subjective opinion, call your statement - rubbish.
I will even throw you a bone.
https://www.amazon.com/Marijuana-Madness-Deepak-Cyril-DSouza...
Re: Oregon decriminalized hard drugs – early results aren’t encouraging
#318I used to strongly support making drugs legal. I thought: this is a free country, you should be able to do what you want. But what I've seen in San Francisco has made me think differently. Most people who use drugs eventually end up not being able to live like normal adults. And no one willingly goes to get help or treatment. The problem will stick around because politicians care more about how things look. They'll s…
> Most people who use drugs eventually end up not being able to live like normal adults.
This isn’t even remotely true. The number of people in SF who use marijuana, cocaine, LSD, ketamine, MDMA, GHB, 2-CB and/or a laundry list of other substances would astonish you.
The majority of them successfully hold jobs: many of them highly paid ones as tech company engineers and execs.
What you associate with “not living like normal adults” is poverty plus opiates.
Re: Oregon decriminalized hard drugs – early results aren’t encouraging
#319Earlier quoted context omitted.
Safer drugs is usually referring to not getting drugs cut with other unknown shit. A common scenario is heroin from dealer A being mixed, then you switch to dealer B and get it pure (or at least more so) but not knowing that, you take the same dosage and overdose
That is never going to go away though. After weed was legalized in California, 2/3 purchases are still from the black market. [1] That market always will exist because cutting makes drugs cheaper and legal drugs will never be able to compete. [1] https://calmatters.org/commentary/2023/06/california-illicit...
How much moonshine do you drink?
As another commenter pointed out, from the article you posted:
> all of this is taking place in an industry without bankruptcy protections, where individuals carry personal liability for business taxes, and where businesses are barred from writing off normal expenses.
So your argument is not backed up by your own link
> That market always will exist because cutting makes drugs cheaper and legal drugs will never be able to compete.
Re: Oregon decriminalized hard drugs – early results aren’t encouraging
#320Supporting legalization / decriminalization of hard drugs is a luxury belief. If you’re in a nice rich circle it’s easy to believe it doesn’t harm anyone except yourself. If you are around people that become drug addicts, it becomes apparent that it drastically harms everyone around them, themselves probably not the most. You can only see so many addict parents throw away the money for kids food, or pawn of their kid…
People in less affluent communities also see the violence when criminalization drives this stuff underground.