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A fridge from 70 years ago has better features than the fridge I own now
311–320 of 531 posts
Re: A fridge from 70 years ago has better features than the fridge I own now
#312Re: A fridge from 70 years ago has better features than the fridge I own now
#313Earlier quoted context omitted.
I mean, in general, things we buy today are a lot more "affordable" while being lower quality. Googling says the average cost of a refrigerator in 1950 was $250 to $400 (for 10 cubic feet -- a fridge today is 20 to 30 ft^3), which would be $3K to $5K in 2023 dollars. If you pay $3K to $5K for a fridge today (for a fridge 2-3x as big as the 1950 fridge), do you get a better longer-lasting one? I'm not sure.
Refrigerators might be a bad example because we got rid of highly effective refrigerants on purpose to patch a hole in the ozone layer. Or perhaps more accurately, to stop poking a giant hole in the ozone layer.
None of the features in that ad missing from modern refrigerators have much to do with the refrigerants, though.
Re: A fridge from 70 years ago has better features than the fridge I own now
#314Earlier quoted context omitted.
> Now, my Bosch dishwasher has been solid. No issues. Seconded, and also confirmed by an appliance repair tech when I asked him about his opinion of the reliability of our various kitchen appliances.
We've had very good experience with Bosch dishwashers.
My only complaint with mine is that, since it doesn't have a heated drying cycle to conserve energy, dishes are sometimes still quite wet when it comes time to put them away.
I've found using the recommended rinse agent and putting them away within an hour of the wash cycle finishing helps tremendously. Since the thing runs at only 41dB, I don't mind running it any time of day.
EDIT: typos
Re: A fridge from 70 years ago has better features than the fridge I own now
#315Earlier quoted context omitted.
I get a little tired of repeating this, but there are some good reasons why fridges (and most appliances) are the way they are now: * Strong regulation on energy use by appliances (modern fridges are much, much more efficient than ones from 70 years ago) * Extreme competition from companies all over the world * Consumers who care more about convenience and cost above all else, and reliability basically not at all The…
>* Consumers who care more about convenience and cost above all else, and reliability basically not at all Don't blame the consumer for this. It's just The Market For Lemons at work. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Market_for_Lemons If you really need someone to blame, then blame the MBAs who buy up quality brands and then sell junk until the reputation is all ground up.
This isn't a relevant paper, not only because it's not about home appliances, but because it's about a situation where there is information asymmetry. I can research everything I need to know about a refrigerator before buying it, including whether it's a piece of junk or not.
Re: A fridge from 70 years ago has better features than the fridge I own now
#316Earlier quoted context omitted.
> new stuff that came out in the last 20 years. There isn’t really that much of this. Let’s consider an oven: Good temperature control: accurate, precise and reliable temperature sensors (e.g. thermocouples) have been around for a long time, as have switching devices that are plenty high speed to make an excellent oven. PID control would be easy with 1980 technology or current technology. Ovens with good temperature…
Yeah, ovens last more or less forever, and haven't had significant efficiency gains in a long time. They're probably the thing you're least likely to want to replace. There's often far more of an incentive with, say, fridges; if you have a 20 year old one, the replacement will likely pay for itself in a few years in power savings. > The obvious safety mechanism to turn off the gas if the burner isn’t lit? Nonexistent…
I'm trying to think how I would reliably prove flame in a way that would resistant to annoying false negatives in the face of a very low simmer. (Somewhat ironically, this is probably the most important setting for which you'd need it. I'm not in any real danger of having a full-bore gas burner go out. I am in danger of having the lowest possible simmer blow out undetected.)
Over a long enough period of time, a sufficiently sensitive raw temperature sensor is probably good enough, but that's not likely to be cheap nor reliable/long-lasting.
Re: A fridge from 70 years ago has better features than the fridge I own now
#317A lot of those features are available in today's fridges. Also, they use less power today. And you really don't have to get one with wifi and a touchscreen.
Yeah but I'd bet the one we see in the video is probably still working, while I'm on my third fridge in 20 years. I think that negates any energy efficiency gains
I have a old basic GE fridge with a mfg date of 2008. It's still going strong and I hate myself for fixing it because it's fucking miserable having to bend down to the fridge as a tall person LOL. (I really want a bottom freezer fridge, single or french door) In the last month I have dropped probably 5 glass items and shattered them because I'll hit my hand on something trying to put things in or out of the fridge.
Re: A fridge from 70 years ago has better features than the fridge I own now
#318Earlier quoted context omitted.
See: Samsung fridges. A huge touchscreen and a water pump/ice maker that will fail in <5 years are standard.
My Samsung fridge is the worst thing I've ever bought.
Interesting. My Samsung TV will soon be 14 years old and still works perfectly. I wonder if there’s a general degradation of their products or it’s a kitchen appliance thing.
Re: A fridge from 70 years ago has better features than the fridge I own now
#319> Thing is, producing crappy, cookie-cutter, uninspired, overpriced junk that falls apart within 5 years (generously speaking) pays more to the shareholders. That's how we got from there to here. This summarizes it quite well for me.
See: Samsung fridges. A huge touchscreen and a water pump/ice maker that will fail in <5 years are standard.
I used to think extended warranties were bullshit. Then I bought the Samsung fridge with the huge touchscreen and the water pump/ice maker.
Re: A fridge from 70 years ago has better features than the fridge I own now
#320Earlier quoted context omitted.
I mean, in general, things we buy today are a lot more "affordable" while being lower quality. Googling says the average cost of a refrigerator in 1950 was $250 to $400 (for 10 cubic feet -- a fridge today is 20 to 30 ft^3), which would be $3K to $5K in 2023 dollars. If you pay $3K to $5K for a fridge today (for a fridge 2-3x as big as the 1950 fridge), do you get a better longer-lasting one? I'm not sure.
The best low-end Frigidaire you can get today is around $750. For $5k you could buy 6.7 of them. Lowe's extended warranty appears to be 5 years, so I'm guessing these things are designed to last 6 years. 6 * 6.7 = 40.2 years. My own estimation is that a $5k fridge today will last perhaps 10. And most of that money is going toward smart features that add complexity, which adds to the risk of having to pay for repairs.…
Not as much as you think - the people selling them want you to think the old ones were awful and need replacing, but they were designed for both reasonable efficiency and decades-long life. (You really need to factor in a literal 6-10x lifespan difference into efficiency and environmental impact figures, too...)
I have a large 60s/70s vintage chest freezer I bought on Craigslist a few years ago. I worried that it was power-hungry, so I got a Kill-A-Watt and monitored it. I don't remember the exact figures I came up with, but it was pretty negligible: Even in my non air conditioned (but attached) garage in Austin (with the highest electric rates in the state, by far), it costs me only about a dollar a month to run. So we're saving a ton of money by being able to buy and store as much frozen food as we want, at a cost of $45 up front to buy the freezer, plus a buck a month to run it - that's a deal to me.
All appliances, back when they were made here in the USA, lasted for decades. I have a cousin who had a (admitttedly expensive at the time) KitchenAid dishwasher from circa 1960! (In very cool copper color!) It still ran perfectly when she sold her ranch house several years ago.