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Study finds link between 'forever chemicals' in cookware and liver cancer

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Re: Study finds link between 'forever chemicals' in cookware and liver cancer

#311

Post by discordance »

shadowtamperer wrote: post #213
acomjean wrote: post #117

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We've been using carbon steel pan. Its like cast iron but much lighter (not light though). They look kinda narly, but you get used to it. You "season" from time to time (oil high heat) but we haven't in at least 6 months and use that thing at least 6 times a week. Easy to clean too. This article kinda give the details. (you have to dodge a modal and click "read more"...sorry) https://www.cooksillustrated.com/equipmen…

Totally unrelated, but a Firefox extension called bypass paywalls clean is great for avoiding this

Does Firefox filter BPA and PFOA/PFAS? - sweet!

Re: Study finds link between 'forever chemicals' in cookware and liver cancer

#312

Post by chefandy »

doctorhandshake wrote: post #194
chefandy wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can get a nice carbon steel or cast iron pan nonstick enough to do things like classical omelets through seasoning alone. (Though the shape of cast iron generally makes it impractical in that particular example.) All the French old timers did. But they need to only be used for that and most home cooks aren't willing to have a pan they only use for one thing. Also, most home cooks-- even the ones that really think…

>> At the temperatures required to cook eggs, there's like zero danger using a modern teflon coated pan. It's the people cranking those pans up to smoking temperatures that you have to worry about. Citation?

Here's the first hit on gooogle.

https://www.webmd.com/food-recipes/is-teflon-coating-safe

Re: Study finds link between 'forever chemicals' in cookware and liver cancer

#313

Post by rvbissell »

jongjong wrote: post #182
rvbissell wrote: post #167

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Seems like a lot of good advice, with one notable exception being induction kitchen appliances.

I think electromagnetic radiation is the area where I'm most reckless because of smartphone, laptop, WiFi Router... It's hard to avoid. But on the plus side this is probably one of the most well-researched areas with fewest gaps. The only uncertainty for me concerns what amount of electromagnetic radiation is safe but I guess quite a lot.

So there is ionizing radiation, and non-ionizing radiation.

The worst that non-ionizing radiation can do to you, is burn you. Just like all stoves, an induction stove is non-ionizing radiation. So just like all stoves, it can burn you (if you touch the steel pan). Even the heat from a flame is non-ionizing radiation.

Microwave ovens also use non-ionizing radiation -- specifically, they use sub-infrared light -- AKA, radio waves. In your body, there are molecules that due to their shape & constituent ions have a dipole moment (water being the most prevalent example.) The dipole moment causes the molecule to vibrate, i.e. heat up in the presence of an E-M field. This is exactly why sunlight feels warm: it is jostling the dipole-momented molecules in your skin. The only reason microwaves are "scarier" than sunlight is, meat is translucent to radio waves, so microwaves -- despite being less energetic than visible light -- can heat up the inside of you where there are no pain receptors.

Then we have ionizing radiation, like UV, X-ray, Gamma-ray, etc. Ain't nobody cooking with those.

TL;DR don't worry unless you're standing next to an unshielded kilowatt radio transmitter.

Re: Study finds link between 'forever chemicals' in cookware and liver cancer

#314

Post by cudgy »

Robotbeat wrote: post #178
acomjean wrote: post #117

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We've been using carbon steel pan. Its like cast iron but much lighter (not light though). They look kinda narly, but you get used to it. You "season" from time to time (oil high heat) but we haven't in at least 6 months and use that thing at least 6 times a week. Easy to clean too. This article kinda give the details. (you have to dodge a modal and click "read more"...sorry) https://www.cooksillustrated.com/equipmen…

What toxic chemicals are produced by heating oils at high heat for seasoning?

Aren’t most common vegetable cooking oils already toxic due to the source product being soaked in solvents during manufacturing process?

My understanding is that you want to buy cold expressed oils to avoid these nasties.

Re: Study finds link between 'forever chemicals' in cookware and liver cancer

#315

Post by _delirium »

stjohnswarts wrote: post #247
yuan43 wrote: post #244

There isn't a human alive today whose blood is free from PFOA and/or PFOS. The question to answer is what are the major routes by which this is happening. There is a lot of discussion in this thread about cookware. The problem is that these chemicals are now found throughout the environment and used in countless products. The stuff is found increasingly in drinking water and foods. Maybe cookware is a major contribut…

doseage makes the poison, no? has there been an explosion of liver cancer?

There's been a significant increase in the U.S. [1], though there are multiple possible causes. Besides environmental pollution, two factors often quoted are increases in viral hepatitis and obesity, which are both risk factors.

[1] "Liver cancer death rates jumped a startling 43 percent in the United States between 2000 and 2016" https://www.mskcc.org/news/what-s-behind-rise-liver-cancer-d...

Re: Study finds link between 'forever chemicals' in cookware and liver cancer

#316

Post by sa1 »

nfhshy68 wrote: post #302
sa1 wrote: post #295

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think chemicals in Teflon come off any easier, but they still do.

Reckons main issue is that it degassed the chemicals into the air. With most range hoods just recirculating the air you're basically getting a face full of it every time you cook.

Isn't it the same issue with oils and high heat during cooking and seasoning?

Re: Study finds link between 'forever chemicals' in cookware and liver cancer

#317

Post by newaccount74 »

boppo1 wrote: post #288
crazygringo wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not really. And I say this as someone who owns and frequently cooks with stainless steel, cast iron, and non-stick, I have for decades and also worked in a professional kitchen at one point. Some things are always better in stainless or cast iron... I tend towards meats in cast iron and veggies in stainless, though it really depends. Other things are easiest in nonstick, but can be learned in stainless, like eggs sun…

How tf do I do stainless sunny-side up without them sticking all over the bottom of the pan? I can do scrambled perfectly with no sticking at all[0], but sunny side up is a mystery. Can't get the whites cooked through without cooking most of the yolk/overcooking bottoms of whites. I cook eggs every morning. [0] the trick is getting the pan hot enough for a water flick to jump and dance before putting oil or butter in…

Here's what I do to avoid sticking:

1) Put drop of vegetable oil in stainless steel pan

2) heat until oil begins to smoke

3) quickly spread oil with paper towel or silicone brush, or by tilting the pan, then remove pan from heat

The pan now has a thin non-stick film, but it is too hot for butter or eggs, so...

4) let the pan cool down a bit

5) add butter

6) add egg

If I do that the stainless steel pan works almost as well as a teflon pan.

Getting sunny side up eggs perfect is still hard, in my experience. In a hotel, I've seen the cook carefully spread out the egg-white with a spatula so it cooks faster, while leaving the yolk liquid.

Re: Study finds link between 'forever chemicals' in cookware and liver cancer

#318

Post by whatshisface »

rayiner wrote: post #226
pmulard wrote: post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I cook eggs on cast iron without them sticking, but it requires maintenance on the seasoning. The trick is to use some butter when cooking with eggs, and they slide right off. A quick wipe with a paper towel and the pan is clean (leaving butter residue helps keep it oiled for next time). Cast iron is a pain to clean if you burn food and the burnt pieces stick, but the investment into learning how to cook with it is w…

I do the same except I use ghee. My grandparents all lived to their 80s in Bangladesh and at this point I’m just trying to do what they did instead of trusting western science. (Aside from vaccines put the pitchforks away.)

It's not that Western science doesn't work, it's just that it has been tasked with selling pans rather than not giving people cancer.

Re: Study finds link between 'forever chemicals' in cookware and liver cancer

#319

Post by xeromal »

acdha wrote: post #303
xeromal wrote: post #187

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Those scrapers are made of plastic. I wonder if that has some forever chemicals. lol

I bought one of these a decade ago - the price has since gone up to $4: https://www.restaurantsupply.com/tablecraft-254-stainless-st... It’ll likely outlive me.

I've seen those used at hibachi and waffle House which probably see a lot more traffic than our homes. Probably a great choice

Re: Study finds link between 'forever chemicals' in cookware and liver cancer

#320

Post by WaxProlix »

acomjean wrote: post #117
pmulard wrote: post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I cook eggs on cast iron without them sticking, but it requires maintenance on the seasoning. The trick is to use some butter when cooking with eggs, and they slide right off. A quick wipe with a paper towel and the pan is clean (leaving butter residue helps keep it oiled for next time). Cast iron is a pain to clean if you burn food and the burnt pieces stick, but the investment into learning how to cook with it is w…

We've been using carbon steel pan. Its like cast iron but much lighter (not light though). They look kinda narly, but you get used to it. You "season" from time to time (oil high heat) but we haven't in at least 6 months and use that thing at least 6 times a week. Easy to clean too. This article kinda give the details. (you have to dodge a modal and click "read more"...sorry) https://www.cooksillustrated.com/equipmen…

Idk what it is but clicking 'read more' doesn't show the results of their testing; it's still blurred.
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