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Apple announces 27-inch 5K Studio Display

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Re: Apple announces 27-inch 5K Studio Display

#311

Post by kllrnohj »

zuwvcfxanh wrote: post #304
Dunedan wrote: post #190

Earlier quoted context omitted.

DisplayPort 1.2 (or newer) and HDMI 2.1 both support 5K at 120Hz when using DSC.

DisplayPort 1.2 cannot even do 5k at 60Hz at 10 bits per channel. You might be thinking about DisplayPort 2.0, which is not yet widely supported in video cards or monitors, and even then it needs the (essentially non-existent) UHBR 20 data rate to get to 120Hz. HDMI 2.1 does support 5K@120Hz@10bpc but requires DSC as you say, which is not very commonly found either. (Note that unlike what a sibling comment states, DS…

> HDMI 2.1 does support 5K@120Hz@10bpc but requires DSC as you say, which is not very commonly found either.

Not very commonly found on what? Nvidia & AMD have been shipping DSC for ~2 generations now (so almost anything within the last 4 years has it)

Re: Apple announces 27-inch 5K Studio Display

#312

Post by kllrnohj »

astrange wrote: post #147
adrianmsmith wrote: post #28

Would be nice to have >5K resolutions to have more pixel density. Alas, macOS doesn't support any native scaling other than 100% and 200%. So if they did release e.g. a 27" 8K monitor, the text would either be too small, or they'd have to use bitmap scaling to make it bigger in which case there'd be no advantage of having an 8K monitor. (EDIT: To clarify, all other scaling factors are done by rendering at either 100%…

Your suggestion was tried for years and failed every time because it doesn’t work. HiDPI shipped because it was 2x or nothing. (Later there was 3x.) The reason Windows developers still think it might work is they have no taste and don’t care about localized UI, pixel cracks, or blurry bitmap controls.

Android has been shipping arbitrary DPI support for longer than iOS or MacOS has supported the limited 2x HiDPI, and it doesn't have the issues you're talking about.

It's definitely possible to do, although retrofitting an existing UI toolkit & ecosystem is a massive challenge.

Re: Apple announces 27-inch 5K Studio Display

#313

Post by cpuguy83 »

deergomoo wrote: post #266
cpuguy83 wrote: post #230

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Remember 60hz CRTs? That was unbearable for me.

For a while I went down the rabbit hole of getting high end CRTs for retro games. I’m in a PAL region though, and the first time I booted up a 50Hz game I wondered how the hell I didn’t spend my entire childhood with a migraine. 60 I’m fine with but 50 I can literally see flickering.

Oh yeah no I could see the flickering at 60. Worse the higher the resolution got.

Re: Apple announces 27-inch 5K Studio Display

#314

Post by zuwvcfxanh »

kllrnohj wrote: post #311
zuwvcfxanh wrote: post #304

Earlier quoted context omitted.

DisplayPort 1.2 cannot even do 5k at 60Hz at 10 bits per channel. You might be thinking about DisplayPort 2.0, which is not yet widely supported in video cards or monitors, and even then it needs the (essentially non-existent) UHBR 20 data rate to get to 120Hz. HDMI 2.1 does support 5K@120Hz@10bpc but requires DSC as you say, which is not very commonly found either. (Note that unlike what a sibling comment states, DS…

> HDMI 2.1 does support 5K@120Hz@10bpc but requires DSC as you say, which is not very commonly found either. Not very commonly found on what? Nvidia & AMD have been shipping DSC for ~2 generations now (so almost anything within the last 4 years has it)

It's not commonly found on monitors. DSC is included starting with DisplayPort 1.4, and a good portion of monitors even today still ship with DP 1.2

Nvidia and AMD have not been shipping DSC with HDMI simply because HDMI included DSC starting with HDMI 2.1, which only the current generation of graphic cards and very few monitors support.

Re: Apple announces 27-inch 5K Studio Display

#315

Post by jrochkind1 »

pkamb wrote: post #267
jrochkind1 wrote: post #95

$1599 isn't quite as bad as I expected, actually. I've still got my old 27" Apple Thunderbolt Display (a puny 2560 by 1440 pixels), which i use daily. (The convenience of built-in video/mic/USB hub, with one cable, is indispensible and more important to me than resolution, and it's been really unclear to me what else could do that with a macbook). But might be ready to upgrade to this guy.

That's the same resolution (screen real estate) as this new one. Just 1x and not 2x Retina.

Ah, good call!

Honestly... I'm not sure I care about making it retina?

Re: Apple announces 27-inch 5K Studio Display

#316

Post by JohnHaugeland »

Bud wrote: post #303
JohnHaugeland wrote: post #281

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Dell's 6 year old 8k UP3218 has entered the chat

That sucker costs $3770, just as a data point.

The Apple monitor stand was over a thousand, wasn't it?

Has this monitor's price been announced?

Re: Apple announces 27-inch 5K Studio Display

#317

Post by DCKing »

zuwvcfxanh wrote: post #297
radicaldreamer wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They've had the iMac line using these displays forever and it hasn't filtered down to other display makers. Only LG via the ultrafine line has used these densities (also Windows and Linux support is lacking or janky)

A portion of that could be related to lack of protocol support. 5k at 60Hz is more bandwidth that HDMI or DisplayPort could provide until very recently. Apple got around it by essentially making it two separate displays bound together in software using a single Thunderbolt cable, but that is only really feasible when you control the entire ecosystem.

Graphics cards that can output 5K60 over a single DisplayPort cable out of the box have been available since mid 2016. If anything, availability of HiDPI PC monitors has gone down since then.

Re: Apple announces 27-inch 5K Studio Display

#318

Post by zuwvcfxanh »

DCKing wrote: post #317
zuwvcfxanh wrote: post #297

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A portion of that could be related to lack of protocol support. 5k at 60Hz is more bandwidth that HDMI or DisplayPort could provide until very recently. Apple got around it by essentially making it two separate displays bound together in software using a single Thunderbolt cable, but that is only really feasible when you control the entire ecosystem.

Graphics cards that can output 5K60 over a single DisplayPort cable out of the box have been available since mid 2016. If anything, availability of HiDPI PC monitors has gone down since then.

That's only true at 8 bits per channel though, which is not what this monitor is. Otherwise yes, you're right

Re: Apple announces 27-inch 5K Studio Display

#319

Post by alwillis »

goosedragons wrote: post #222
dijit wrote: post #167

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apple have always been the first to push higher resolution devices for as long as I've been alive. Laptops in the early 2010's were stuck on 1336x768 until Apple kicked up a fuss about having "retina", same with phones which had comically low resolutions until Apple made a fuss about it with the iPhone 4. Sadly my eyes aren't as good as they used to be so I can't make a lot of use of the extra real-estate, but it alw…

The ThinkPad R50p had a QXGA screen (2048x1536) option back in 2003. Granted Windows had zilch support for it which is probably why it died. Even the base model was a 1600x1200 screen. And there was plenty of phones with 200+ ppi before the iPhone 4. I think it has more to do with higher PPI screens getting cheaper and Apple could just get more supply first...

Remember that it’s more than just raw resolution.

Of course macOS supports these higher resolutions but there’s also the color calibration and support for wider color gamuts other than sRGB and having that all integrated together.

For example, the iMac had Display P3 (a color space 50% bigger than RGB) support starting in 2015.

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