Earlier quoted context omitted.
Virus just wants to replicate and spread as much as possible. Sometimes the side effect of this is death etc. If this one spreads super fast, has generally more mild effects... it will ramp up faster, infect all, and may get more severe so that it can last longer in the host and spread more. But the combo of high infectiousness and more mild side effects might be a net negative for this one. If we get a good amount o…
Viruses don't "want", anthropomorphizing COVID like media headlines do is a bit of a "language virus" in and of itself that makes global understanding of what's going on more difficult. AFAIK the virus mutates randomly, and we just see more of the more infectious and less deathly (in the short and mid-term) variants because those are the ones that spread faster and successfully among humans, but attributing even coll…
South Africa’s omicron coronavirus outbreak subsides as fast as it grew
311–320 of 515 posts
Re: South Africa’s omicron coronavirus outbreak subsides as fast as it grew
#312Earlier quoted context omitted.
Not sure what you're trying to say. Of course there is a limited pool of people to infect. And various effects can cause infections to spread in multiple waves even far from herd immunity. And yet, you can go from a few rare cases in your country to hospitals overflowing in a couple of weeks. That's because of exponential growth, obviously.
The point is that 1) exponential growth has consistently ceased before the hospitals overflowed too bad 2) exponential growth confuses readers into thinking that a small boost in spread rate means many more will be infected. This isn’t true because the exponential phase is brief and is a progression towards a ceiling defined by the graph, not an arbitrary period of time. Like what we are seeing in South Africa right…
Re: South Africa’s omicron coronavirus outbreak subsides as fast as it grew
#313Earlier quoted context omitted.
> What exactly are they waiting on? The thing that needs to not happen is filling up hospitals. People died where I live because they could not get access to 'elective' surgery due to the medical system being slammed during the most recent Delta wave. Once that's not a factor, things will start getting more normal.
If hospital capacity is such a concern, why has there been just about zero effort in spinning up some kind of capacity to deal with Covid? Wasn't that the entire rationale of these lockdowns in the first place? To build capacity for covid? Like, it's been 2 years. We shouldn't be doing any of these restrictions at all. We should be angry at our governments wasting 2 years of our non-refundable time on this earth whil…
Re: South Africa’s omicron coronavirus outbreak subsides as fast as it grew
#314I’ve been tanking some downvotes for the past few days for saying this. Disease spread is only exponential for a brief initial period. It is not a good mental or even general model for how disease spreads. We have two years of observational covid data that shows this to be true. Spread slows down rapidly long before reaching 100%. People hear “5x as infectious” and reason that due to the nature of exponential models,…
Thank you. It is mind boggling to me how politicians and scientists (well, mostly MDs) keep talking about exponential growth and make horrible predictions, without realizing that exponential growth is never sustainable - a logistic growth is what often happens in reality if resources are limited.
First and foremost, we can only make predictions based upon the data we have. The data we have is mostly based upon people going for voluntary testing. Given the variability in symptoms that motivate testing, varying levels of awareness to potential exposure, varying willingness to get tested, and the availability of testing, the number of known exposures will make it look like we're in an exponential growth phase even when things are tapering off. It is hard to blame public health organizations for accepting this data at face value since the potential consequences of not doing so are extremely bleak.
The other consideration is that people will modify their behaviour based upon perceived risk, whether or not restrictions are imposed. People will tend to comply with restrictions, go about life as normal, follow some sort of middle path, or impose tighter restrictions upon themselves. It takes a truly special person to put themselves into a position of greater risk. Even then, there is a good chance that they are doing little more than translating one high risk circumstance into another (more or less balancing out the growth). We are facing a situation where scientists can make predictions based upon what is known, e.g. the outcome of restrictions, or making predictions based upon anticipated behaviour. Given there is not enough data to model anticipated behaviour, the natural response is to rely upon models that use expected behaviour (e.g. compliance with restrictions or no response). Since the average actual response will prefer over compliance, more bleak predictions are made.
Finally, everyone has a different understanding of life now as compared to life before the pandemic. I remember when the coronavirus first caught my attention: it was when major U.S. universities started shutting down. I remember when I first started taking it seriously: it was when my provincial government issued a shelter in place style order. Since that time, I have paid attention to what is happening and thinking about how I should respond. Sometimes it is in an acute manner. Sometimes is in a cursory manner. Either way, I am more likely to notice and respond preemptively to outbreaks. I suspect that many, if not most, people are the same even if their only actions are stocking up to prepare for the worse. Again, this will affect outcomes.
Re: South Africa’s omicron coronavirus outbreak subsides as fast as it grew
#315Earlier quoted context omitted.
> This is a battlefield. No, it's literally not. > It's an emergency, remember? Yes and all battlefields are emergencies but not all emergencies have the same conditions (and thus make the same measures expedient) as battlefields. > Do whatever it takes. Sure, but what you are suggesting is not what it takes, or something that would be reasonably expected to be useful and effective. > 2 years and these "experts" stil…
So you are totally okay with the government flushing 2 years of your incredibly short life down the drain to "flatten the curve to build up supplies and healthcare" with zero results? In fact, so little results that many places are locking down yet again like it was march of 2020? Do y'all not value your lives or short time on this earth at all? You should be furious the government is still playing the "protect healt…
I reject that that's an even remotely accurate description of anything that has happened, or has any other relevancd to reality.
> many places are locking down yet again
What places? Unless you are using “locking down” as loosely as you’ve used “battlefield”, that's not actually happening, anywhere.
> And they have the audacity to blame you
The only people I’ve seen anyone in government even approximately blame are particular government decision-makers who allegedly deliberately acted to make things worse and the unvaccinated, neither group of which included me. So, again, I reject that this description is grounded in reality.
Re: South Africa’s omicron coronavirus outbreak subsides as fast as it grew
#316Earlier quoted context omitted.
> which is useful on the battlefield to keep people alive to get to proper medical care This is a battlefield. It's an emergency, remember? Do whatever it takes. We forced people to sacrifice their short-ass lives in lockdown so these people could figure it out. Where is the results? 2 years and these "experts" still want us to continue locking down to protect a healthcare system they had 2 years to build up specific…
Let's say it's 100% of the government's fault, which I don't believe, but let's just say it for argument's sake. So why don't you run for office and do it differently?
Who else's fault is it? It isn't the public, that is for sure. You can't blame people for human behavior and "not taking this seriously". These governments asked us to pay one of the highest costs you can pay--they asked us to donate 2 years of our short lives to their cause. And thus far, they have done absolutely nothing but blame the public for their failings.
Life is short. Being asked to flush 2 years of your life down the toilet in this purgatory we are in is a huge ask. Don't you think we should see some results now?
Re: South Africa’s omicron coronavirus outbreak subsides as fast as it grew
#317Earlier quoted context omitted.
Ok I know it's off topic but I have got to ask, what is up with archive.md links? I have never in my life successfully loaded an archive.md URL. I either get straight up DNS errors or very occasionally I see a spinner that never finishes loading. Yet they must work for others because they're constantly being posted here.
Maybe you're using cloudflare dns? https://community.cloudflare.com/t/archive-is-error-1001/182...
I thought I understand DNS but I guess I don't.
Re: South Africa’s omicron coronavirus outbreak subsides as fast as it grew
#318Re: South Africa’s omicron coronavirus outbreak subsides as fast as it grew
#319Earlier quoted context omitted.
So you are totally okay with the government flushing 2 years of your incredibly short life down the drain to "flatten the curve to build up supplies and healthcare" with zero results? In fact, so little results that many places are locking down yet again like it was march of 2020? Do y'all not value your lives or short time on this earth at all? You should be furious the government is still playing the "protect healt…
> So you are totally okay with the government flushing 2 years of your incredibly short life down the drain I reject that that's an even remotely accurate description of anything that has happened, or has any other relevancd to reality. > many places are locking down yet again What places? Unless you are using “locking down” as loosely as you’ve used “battlefield”, that's not actually happening, anywhere. > And they…
And if the goal isn't to flatten the curve to build supplies and increase healthcare capacity, please inform me what the goal actually is. 'Cause if that ain't it... I have no fucking clue what we are doing.
Re: South Africa’s omicron coronavirus outbreak subsides as fast as it grew
#320The panic surrounding Omicron is absurd. Take a look at these two charts. Omicron cases spiked in SA. Deaths didn't budge. At all. https://i.imgur.com/TgRmz4F.png [1] Omicron is a good thing, if your baseline is Delta. But I'm still waiting for the US media stop hyperventilating about it. 1. https://graphics.reuters.com/world-coronavirus-tracker-and-m...
That chart is misleading; the rise/spike in deaths is always delayed from the rise/spike in cases. It does seem like Omicron is less deadly than Delta. The big concern is that because it's so significantly more contagious, that even though a smaller percentage of infected people will require ventilators, the absolute number will be high enough to overwhelm hospitals. Sources: Dr. John Campbell, Dr. Larry Brilliant (W…