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20 years after 9/11: Will we ever stop taking our shoes off at airports?

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Re: 20 years after 9/11: Will we ever stop taking our shoes off at airports?

#311

Post by titzer »

tylersmith wrote: post #287
titzer wrote: post #235

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You think masks are petty symbolism? I think that kind of trolling just raises the temperature here, which I'd like to avoid, so no, please, do not go on.

It's not trolling just because you disagree with it.

> In internet slang, a troll is a person who posts inflammatory, insincere, digressive, extraneous, or off-topic messages in an online community (such as social media (Twitter, Facebook, Instagram, etc.), a newsgroup, forum, chat room, or blog), with the intent of provoking readers into displaying emotional responses, or manipulating others' perception.

From Wikipedia. Inflammatory, digressive, and off-topic = trolling.

Re: 20 years after 9/11: Will we ever stop taking our shoes off at airports?

#312

Post by goatlover »

peakaboo wrote: post #296
bserge wrote: post #248

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The goal of terrorism is to scare people into restricting their own freedoms. It has worked amazingly well so far. To any motivated anti-society organization or person, this is huge leverage. A few deaths leading to a noticeably more authoritarian state? What's not to love? It doesn't even matter if the authorities do their job and punish those responsible, the people will still choose to restrict their own freedoms…

This is exactly what it's about. Humans constantly trading away more and more of their freedoms until we live inside a prison.

But how does that advance the cause of terrorist organizations?

Re: 20 years after 9/11: Will we ever stop taking our shoes off at airports?

#313

Post by sureglymop »

irrational wrote: post #276
spoonjim wrote: post #231

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That security isn’t necessarily to stop terrorism. It’s also to stop people from bringing in weapons and then using them in drunken brawls.

But, that wasn’t even a problem pre-2001. Do you not remember what things were like pre 9/11?

I think what he's mentioning has nothing to do with 9/11 though, right? He's talking about football hooligans. I only know that there are such scenes in soccer here in Europe and it can get pretty rough when they clash.

Re: 20 years after 9/11: Will we ever stop taking our shoes off at airports?

#314

Post by arminiusreturns »

the_snooze wrote: post #22
tyingq wrote: post #8

The interesting part to me is that the mode of attack for 9/11 can't easily be repeated. It depended on passengers assuming the plane was being hijacked, and that they would eventually be released. That stopped working on the 3rd (edit: 4th) plane. I don't see how it would work again. Passengers now default to assuming there's no path to live other than fighting back. Meaning many of the measures we still take aren't…

Absolutely. It's not a 9/11-style attack we need to be worried about. No one will let a plane get commandeered ever again. The 9/11 terrorists took advantage of the "comply with the hijackers" policy in place at the time. That opportunity ended the moment the second plane hit the towers. The real threat is lone wolf random attacks on the general public like the DC sniper. That's a very low-cost high-impact attack tha…

> No one will let a plane get commandeered ever again.

Won't do much good when the controls are hijacked from terra. This narrative on 9/11 being played on this thread is poppycock.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V4Zj1fnGtjk

Re: 20 years after 9/11: Will we ever stop taking our shoes off at airports?

#315

Post by mrmcd »

bluedino wrote: post #272
mrmcd wrote: post #216

Just pay the government a $100 bribe^W 'application processing fee' for Precheck or Global Entry, and no more taking off your shoes. Or taking out your laptops or liquids, or having a government employee look you over in the nudie scanner. Also, shorter, faster lines. But all this is actually necessary and not security theater. We promise.

$85 and it lasts for 5 years. Quite the deal.

Right. GE is $100/5 years. So, might as well pay the extra $3/yr for faster passport lines too.

Re: 20 years after 9/11: Will we ever stop taking our shoes off at airports?

#316

Post by Scoundreller »

noetic_techy wrote: post #47

I'll take it a step further. We need a total paradigm redesign of airports. Imagine and airport designed to the point where you can literally drive up (or be dropped by an autonomous vehicle) 10 minutes before your flight, Throw your luggage onto a belt where a robot auto tags it based on your a facial recognition algorithm, and walk through an unobtrusive security point that's totally AI driven, and walk direct to y…

What bugs me is how every airport is a completely custom design.

Somehow, no two airports are ever alike, and I have a hard time understanding how that happened. There’s no clones at all.

Like, I understand they each have their own geographical constraints, but so does a McDonalds or a Walmart, and somehow I can walk into any of those on the planet without feeling too confused.

Every airport is a multi-billion dollar project designed anew from the ground up. Even when it’s a greenfield build. Dunno why they can’t just pick an existing airport design and say “build that”.

Even roller-coasters will have their clones at different parks (authorized or unauthorized).

Re: 20 years after 9/11: Will we ever stop taking our shoes off at airports?

#317

Post by irae »

zxcvbn4038 wrote: post #215

Or you can pay a fee and bypass the lines, not remove your clothing, whiz through the diplomatic lane at JFK. I think most of the screening is less about security and more about selling convenience.

I was tempted for a moment to agree. Maybe for the flight companies and airports it could be true. But since many of those measures became law, then it is a political problem. It would bring bad reputation to any politician trying to remove the law. So it is a much bigger issue now.

Re: 20 years after 9/11: Will we ever stop taking our shoes off at airports?

#318

Post by ldehaan »

Shoes off. Belt off Backpack ready for search Full body genital scan Mask scanner with RFID chip reader Vaccine passport Passport/drivers license or state ID Credit or bank card only Social media must be free of x/y posts

-Or-

Pay to skip the line

Re: 20 years after 9/11: Will we ever stop taking our shoes off at airports?

#319

Post by [deleted] »

ZanyProgrammer wrote: post #27
antihero wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Any attempt at this, the terrorists will have a game plan of how to convince people on the flight to chill out, that they have no mal-intent towards the passengers, etc etc. I mean it might not work, but I reckon they'd put on a really good act and manipulate people heavily into making it feel like they are actually quite safe and it would be a poor decision to try and overrun them.

And yet what you’re describing has never happened to the best of my knowledge (at least in the west).

[deleted]

Re: 20 years after 9/11: Will we ever stop taking our shoes off at airports?

#320

Post by aww_dang »

stouset wrote: post #257
aww_dang wrote: post #208

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I initially thought he was claiming the inverse, that mask proponents were extremists. From the perspective of 2019, that wouldn't be an unreasonable assumption, but here we are. Today people are advocating using the force of the state, in other words violence against those who do not share their views on mask mandates.

Can we kindly stop using hyperbole like “using the force of the state, in other words violence” as an argument against literally any governmental policy ever? In this same fantasy universe jack-booted government thugs are beating up people who don’t wear seat belts or who mislabel the nutritional contents on a package of cheese, except that’s just not what ever actually happens in the real world. These kinds of laws…

There's a distinction between a voluntary practice and a compulsory practice. The distinction centers around individuals being compelled by violence. The kind thing to do would be to minimize our use of compulsion as much as pragmatically possible.

>Can we kindly stop using hyperbole... anti-maskers have almost certainly killed more Americans

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