Live data from Hacker News

Launch HN: Fella (YC W20) – Tackling men's obesity using medication and coaching

news.ycombinator.com

311–318 of 318 posts

Re: Launch HN: Fella (YC W20) – Tackling men's obesity using medication and coaching

#311

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> overreport their physical activity, like "I can jog 10 miles", or "I play tennis about 7 hours a week", or "I regularly make 60 mile bike rides". If you do, you're the extreme outlier, and it doesn't change the data. Assuming you can do those things, you're almost certainly still in your 20s, and the health effects of your weight haven't really caught up with your body yet I'm 37, and 6'5". and if you're calling me…

I said that you may be an extreme outlier. You're also larger than every NFL player in history, everyone in World's Strongest Man, etc. A 10 mile jog (let's say 80-100 minutes of uninterrupted running) is the sort of "I could eat 50 eggs" number people pull out. At 6'5", you are an outlier. 2kcal is too low, much as it's too high for the average woman. This doesn't mean that metabolism is a "colloquial" term. It mean…

> I cut calories and I lost weight" is not anecdotal. It's factual

I think perhaps you're misunderstanding what "anecdote" means? Anecdotes can certainly be factual - the point is not that it's false, it's that it's not sufficiently representative. In particular, I wasn't challenging his assertion that cutting calories allowed him to lose weight, only the implicit claim that doing so is a universally straightforward and successful approach to effecting actual weight loss.

> and all the rest should be explored alongside drugs

Well yes! That's my position! I don't think "drugs will solve this problem", I think the problem is solvable, and that we need to understand it and its context better in order to do so. I'm a tinkerer, I've been experimenting with my own habits, diet, and activities constantly trying to better understand how I can be healthier and still happy, and there have been some real gains from that process.

I feel like (a) you don't agree with the approach Fella is taking (which is fine, you've clearly looked into it more than I have), and (b) you've decided that my opinions about the effectiveness of diets are somehow "on their side". I think I've been really clear about this, but I have no stake in their game, aside from being excited to see that people are trying to do something other than convince fat people that this diet will totally work (and if it doesn't it's because they were yet again bad people that deserve to be fat.)

> "the physical, psychological, and emotional components" is a long way of saying "it's hard", and "the experiential variance I'm describing" is "the payoff did not seem to be worth the cost".

Not even close. But you seem intelligent, so I'm left wondering if you're intentionally misinterpreting me to score some kind of internet points?

The intent of those phrases is to emphasize that the costs to the humans involved vary. They are different. So yeah, "the payoff did not seem to be worth the cost", in the same sense that a man with a bad knee would evaluate the cost/value of paying for a taxi differently.

Re: Launch HN: Fella (YC W20) – Tackling men's obesity using medication and coaching

#312
The only thing you need to beat obesity is exercise and reduced caloric intake.

The idea that entire companies can be started to wrap that fact in a neat little package for people makes me depressed.

> It leads to an average 15% decrease in body weight, efficacy close to bariatric surgery [3]. However, medication-assisted treatment for obesity is still stigmatized by family doctors and therefore hard to access.

This won’t lead to a healthier society, it will lead to a more wasteful and consumeristic one.

Re: Launch HN: Fella (YC W20) – Tackling men's obesity using medication and coaching

#313

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Diets don't fail because they're inherently flawed and the system is more complex than we think it is. Diets fail because people fail. "I tried and I failed, but I still do all this physical stuff or could if I wanted to" is dishonesty, whether intended or not. Asserting that, for some unspecified (but large) fraction of the population, tracking your caloric intake and energy expenditure versus the number on the scal…

Your attitude toward the topic is fairly typical, and pretty harmful. "Diets fail because people fail" is true , of course - my point is that people "failing" is not always (or even usually) a result of intrinsic weakness of willpower, but a result of substantial variation in the real world experience of maintaining a calorie-restricted diet. As a thought experiment, imagine if, for every 100 calories of deficit in t…

On re-read, this jumped out at me:

> Diets don't fail because they're inherently flawed and the system is more complex than we think it is. Diets fail because people fail.

The system includes the people. If the people "fail", that is relevant information, and should be used to evaluate the 'effectiveness' of the approach. The system is extremely complex, including as it does all of human psychology and physicality, and yet every one of these discussions is dogged by people like you, that think that the problem is just that people don't try hard enough.

Well sure they don't, that's also the reason they can't all bench 400 pounds - "hard enough" is the critical phrase here, and your language and attitude place all of the blame on the individual. It's a lot like explaining that depressed people are responsible for their own emotional state, and should just start exercising and cheer up - it's factually true, and yet also unhelpful, counterproductive, and insulting.

Re: Launch HN: Fella (YC W20) – Tackling men's obesity using medication and coaching

#314
post #160

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As someone whose weight has been all over the place in my life, I really appreciate hearing this. I've known it is true forever, but it is rare to hear other people saying it. There is much more to weight than calories in/out. Some people can skip a meal without noticing, others count the minutes until the next meal. I always flip it on its head. For some reason it is easy for people to understand that certain people…

I've really never thought about that flip before.

I explain it that way to people all the time and they almost all say that.

Re: Launch HN: Fella (YC W20) – Tackling men's obesity using medication and coaching

#315

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your attitude toward the topic is fairly typical, and pretty harmful. "Diets fail because people fail" is true , of course - my point is that people "failing" is not always (or even usually) a result of intrinsic weakness of willpower, but a result of substantial variation in the real world experience of maintaining a calorie-restricted diet. As a thought experiment, imagine if, for every 100 calories of deficit in t…

On re-read, this jumped out at me: > Diets don't fail because they're inherently flawed and the system is more complex than we think it is. Diets fail because people fail. The system includes the people . If the people "fail", that is relevant information , and should be used to evaluate the 'effectiveness' of the approach. The system is extremely complex, including as it does all of human psychology and physicality,…

Well written.

Re: Launch HN: Fella (YC W20) – Tackling men's obesity using medication and coaching

#316
post #312

The only thing you need to beat obesity is exercise and reduced caloric intake. The idea that entire companies can be started to wrap that fact in a neat little package for people makes me depressed. > It leads to an average 15% decrease in body weight, efficacy close to bariatric surgery [3]. However, medication-assisted treatment for obesity is still stigmatized by family doctors and therefore hard to access. This…

This is the same ineffective trope said repeatedly without grounding in practical solutions which help real people get to a healthier weight.

Re: Launch HN: Fella (YC W20) – Tackling men's obesity using medication and coaching

#317
post #65

[flagged]

Of course obesity is an emotional topic but attacking someone personally about it is way, way beyond the pale. Breaking the HN guidelines will get you banned here, regardless of how right you are, or feel you are, about obesity and other topics. No more of this, please. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Dang, honestly, fuck you for censoring that post.

Re: Launch HN: Fella (YC W20) – Tackling men's obesity using medication and coaching

#318

Wow. This is really interesting and important. I’m not your target customer and don’t know a ton about health tech, so I’m not sure I can help you, but I wish I could. thank you for taking this on. Someone should. Sometimes the science and medicine is there but branding, marketing, and positioning in a bigger value prop aren’t things that doctors and hospitals are prepared to handle at scale. So, this is cool. I do k…

Thanks man. Just so I've fully understood here: > "The person who got the surgery would often lose only the plurality of the weight, and sometimes not even that." By this you're meaning the whole family lost weight after one individual had bariatric surgery?

Yep, exactly.
Post reply on HN