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Yamaha MOTOROiD

global.yamaha-motor.com

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Re: Yamaha MOTOROiD

#311

Post by shric »

NikolaNovak wrote: post #67
CraigJPerry wrote: post #5

I can’t wait for electric motorbikes to be more diverse and advanced. I used to be a “my loud exhaust helps me to be seen” kinda guy. Until one day, sat in standstill traffic in my car on the M74 motorway just outside Glasgow, a rider on a BMW S1000XR, with the same loud exhaust as on mine, filtered past the window and I didn’t hear him until he was level with my rear passenger door. Exhausts sound great, i love the…

I owned ride 6-7 different motorcycles, and I believe there's a special place in hell for those who put on loud aftermarket exhausts. Sure, it sounds nice to them . It shows an astonishing disregard to thousands of other people they impact daily. Let alone your next 10 neighbour houses who put up with it on consistent basis. ... :O There's no increased safety factor - there's no real location or distance clue such lo…

I have a BMW S1000RR with a stock exhaust and I want to get an after market exhaust simply because the stock one sounds awful. I don't want it to be particularly loud, just a more pleasant note. Unfortunately any after market exhaust may be louder. This is why I've held back on buying one.

Re: Yamaha MOTOROiD

#312

Post by Valakas_ »

CraigJPerry wrote: post #5

I can’t wait for electric motorbikes to be more diverse and advanced. I used to be a “my loud exhaust helps me to be seen” kinda guy. Until one day, sat in standstill traffic in my car on the M74 motorway just outside Glasgow, a rider on a BMW S1000XR, with the same loud exhaust as on mine, filtered past the window and I didn’t hear him until he was level with my rear passenger door. Exhausts sound great, i love the…

Oh you were seen alright. Just not on a positive way. I have constant noisy motorbikes passing in front of my building and often feel like shooting one of their tires because of the stress of having to deal with this constant noise. If exhausts sound great, go to the country side and listen to it, but don't force others to.

Re: Yamaha MOTOROiD

#313

Post by rapjr9 »

Don't these head down designs for motorcycles kill peoples necks? Having to keep your head tilted up means the bike is only useful for short drives. Ride it across several USA states and your neck will be frozen, especially with the neck muscles having to fight both gravity (with added weight of helmet) and bumps to keep the head level. Head down lowers air resistance in racing, but seems useless for a vehicle you actually intend to use for transportation. If they really want an advanced design lay the rider completely flat, face down, and invent an optical/camera system that gives them the same visibility that having the head vertical would.

Re: Yamaha MOTOROiD

#314

Post by bayindirh »

VBprogrammer wrote: post #253
bayindirh wrote: post #244

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can you be underestimating how sound propagates in silent environments, and our brains are so efficient at filtering background noise? Since the pandemic started, traffic around my home decreased tremendously and, even smallest traffic became bothering. In sparsely populated areas, that oddball sound is much more disturbing to residents which are used to silence. BTW, getting angry to people who we don't know persona…

I'm intrigued about which part of that response you thought was angry? The front elevation of my house is less than 15ft away from a reasonably busy road. I'm no stranger to the perils of noise pollution. In fact, around one week a year, last week in fact, the M25 (the London ring road) is diverted overnight along our road. This means we have heavy trucks passing our home all night long. We also live under the depart…

> I'm intrigued about which part of that response you thought was angry?

From your general tone, but I'm not a native English speaker, so I might be mistaken. I won't be insistent.

I won't dispute about the noise levels of your home, but you might be more tolerant to noise then people in quiet places, because auditory subsystem learns to ignore it, and it decreases noise sensitivity somewhat.

> I think people should live and let live though.

I'm not against that, but I don't agree that one's hobby can bother others under the name of freedom. We see a lot of similar stuff done by local governments. UK is installing "decorative" items on the walls and benches in parks to prevent skaters from using walls for tricks for example. Contrarily, I'm sure that there are specially built skating parks for who want to board and skate.

In the same perspective, I'm not against biking. It's a nice culture. It's important, however loud pipes, dangerous driving under the name of increased visibility, etc. are not acceptable in my book. Similarly, if a quiet country is ruined by excessive motor noise, I can understand the residents' reaction. As I've said somewhere in the comment, my father was a rally driver. I'm no stranger to powerful engines and cars, yet I don't like the noise of a modified car screaming through a nearby street in the silence of the night.

Ford's latest Mustangs have a "neighborhood mode" when the engine is first started, which enable all mufflers and disable resonators. That thing sounds like a family sedan in that mode. If a car manufacturer is installing something like that to a naturally loud beast, it's telling IMHO (and I applaud them for their ingenuity).

If we (not in the terms of you and me, but in the terms of general public) can apply some empathy to the issue, it's possible to find a nice middle ground around this issue.

Re: Yamaha MOTOROiD

#315

Post by NikolaNovak »

imoverclocked wrote: post #286
imoverclocked wrote: post #266

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It might produce EMI though. (if we are picking nits)

Wow, downvoted into obscurity despite factual basis. Overclocking can in fact produce EMI. I realize that audible noise is very readily recognized as harmful. It’s been studied and proven to be harmful, as have other forms of pollution. I think EMI affects less people directly but it’s still noise.

I think you're down voted due to ridiculousness / perceived intellectual dishonesty.

You're putting the argument that overclocking a CPU, due to increased impact, is analogous to putting a straight pipe on a Harley.

I would imagine that difference is sufficient number of orders of magnitude different to be a fundamentally ignorable comparison, and obviously so.

A loud pipe has an immediate and continuous demonstrable negative impact on hundreds and thousands of people per trip.

You would need to show me some reaaally good studies to show that increased (not just baseline) EMI of overclocking is even readily detectable through the faradey cage of computer case and then three houses down the road, and distinguishable in the noise of street transformers, Fridges, laser printers, etc.

Re: Yamaha MOTOROiD

#316

Post by NikolaNovak »

johng wrote: post #237
83457 wrote: post #139

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I always assumed that the point of loud vehicles was to assert dominance by being an asshole. If people are annoyed and upset then it is working exactly as intended. You have provoked an emotion that fuels your ego and image of yourself as a bad ass that doesn't care about other people.

I’ve always said that an exhaust should only be as loud as the vehicle or motorcycle is fast. I put exhausts on my vehicles and motorcycles that free the flow of air which makes the engine (an air pump) perform better. I never put one on a slow vehicle just to make it louder. Consider this the same as overclocking a cpu. You are burning up more electricity than you “need” to, all for your own personal greed or need f…

>>"I put exhausts on my vehicles and motorcycles that free the flow of air which makes the engine (an air pump) perform better"

As I mentioned in other thread

1. What proportion of people with straight pipes take them on a track or engage in competitive endeavour

2. What proportion take advanced classes and have the skillset to take advantage of increase performance

3. What proportion put their bike on a dyno before and after to have a foggiest clue if straight pipe does anything

4. What proportion of them tunes the rest of their bike to take advantage of new pipe

5. For how many loud cruisers is performance in any way even remotely an actual consideration? You don't buy a cruiser for speed.

Finally, you can get high flow pipes which are quiet. But that's not really the point is it ;)

I actually respect people who say "I got it because it's loud and cool and gives me a rush" because they're at least honest a*oles, more than 98% of people who claim its for performance but don't have a clue - they're fooling themselves as much as others :-/

Re: Yamaha MOTOROiD

#317

Post by imoverclocked »

NikolaNovak wrote: post #315
imoverclocked wrote: post #286

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wow, downvoted into obscurity despite factual basis. Overclocking can in fact produce EMI. I realize that audible noise is very readily recognized as harmful. It’s been studied and proven to be harmful, as have other forms of pollution. I think EMI affects less people directly but it’s still noise.

I think you're down voted due to ridiculousness / perceived intellectual dishonesty. You're putting the argument that overclocking a CPU, due to increased impact, is analogous to putting a straight pipe on a Harley. I would imagine that difference is sufficient number of orders of magnitude different to be a fundamentally ignorable comparison, and obviously so. A loud pipe has an immediate and continuous demonstrable…

There are a few good insights here.

If it affects 1% of the population instead of 50% then it’s far more likely to be dismissed.

Also, given other similar noise, adding a little more doesn’t seem like an issue.

None of this is to say that two stroke motors and loud vehicles don’t get on my nerves. Rather, we all have more in common than we think we do.

I used to be considered “sensitive” because I hated all of the latent noise. I feel like I would be considered “reasonable” based on this thread which is now backed by studies showing noise and environmental pollution as having long-term, negative side-effects.

On a technical note, Faraday cages are much better at protecting receiving electronics from outside signals than the other way around. Signals have an easier time leaving a Faraday cage than entering.

Re: Yamaha MOTOROiD

#318

Post by NikolaNovak »

imoverclocked wrote: post #317
NikolaNovak wrote: post #315

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think you're down voted due to ridiculousness / perceived intellectual dishonesty. You're putting the argument that overclocking a CPU, due to increased impact, is analogous to putting a straight pipe on a Harley. I would imagine that difference is sufficient number of orders of magnitude different to be a fundamentally ignorable comparison, and obviously so. A loud pipe has an immediate and continuous demonstrable…

There are a few good insights here. If it affects 1% of the population instead of 50% then it’s far more likely to be dismissed. Also, given other similar noise, adding a little more doesn’t seem like an issue. None of this is to say that two stroke motors and loud vehicles don’t get on my nerves. Rather, we all have more in common than we think we do. I used to be considered “sensitive” because I hated all of the la…

>If it affects 1% of the population instead of 50% then it’s far more likely to be dismissed.

I wouldn't call it insight, I'd call it prioritization; but perhaps more to the point, you've provided no evidence whatsoever that overclocking a CPU will affect any proportion of population whatsoever (not 50%, not 1%, not 0.01%), at any distance, in any circumstance. And remember, we're not even saying "whether a computer emits EMI". The claim put forward is that overclocking a PC, say from 3ghz to 3.3ghz, has detectable enough negative impact on people other than the owner / in other households, to be part of this discussion.

Certainly, I currently do not believe so and am dismissing your argument for that reason. You are welcome and indeed encouraged to persuade me otherwise :)

Re: Yamaha MOTOROiD

#319

Post by NikolaNovak »

reader_mode wrote: post #213
NikolaNovak wrote: post #179

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As I said (GP here) - I rode motorcycles since 2008; I'll grant you that sound is absolutely part of the fun - but loud aftermarket exhausts, detonating straight pipes, etc which are the subject of the topic here -- I feel the world's balance is overwhelmingly on the negative in the "joy to self" vs "average impact to others". I understand many people put the aftermarket pipes "for themselves", at least consciously,…

I'm not trying to defend anyone - I'm just saying that looking at it from the perspective of "they are just doing it to show off" etc. is not really my experience (there's some of that for sure) I'm not a fan of aftermarket exhausts, stock one is plenty loud for me and doesn't disturb anyone while I'm riding normaly. I especially dislike the grandpa chopper bikes that sound like tanks, like you said my sports bike ge…

I think we are likely indeed converging to a point of agreement.

Things are usually on a spectrum and not binary; I agree that part of the thrill of ride is the sensation - vibration, noise of wind and engine, gravity forces, etc - and certainly manufacturers of both performance bikes and cars frequently tune the engine and particularly exhaust for desired image and sound.

I still maintain though that there is a wrong side/portion of that spectrum, and that e.g. a straight pipe on a Harley does far more negative impact on others than positive impact (real or perceived performance, rush, etc) on the rider.

Re: Yamaha MOTOROiD

#320

Post by salmo »

ece wrote: post #297
salmo wrote: post #284

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it's wonderful to see "pure R&D" these days. The days of Bell Labs, Xerox PARC, etc. are gone. Even NASA is so much more restrained. Focus on practicality leads to incremental change. But free research and aspirational (maybe impractical) goals are what brought us the revolutionary technology we rely on today. This is as kooky as Doug Englebart's team's work was at the time, and similar in the focus on the hu…

Augment?

The Augmentation Research Center (aka Augment) was Englebart's lab at SRI.

This was a project that wanted to change computers from being number crunching machines to "augmenting human intellect". Things like the mouse, windowing systems, video conferencing, and hypertext came out of that lab and spilled into Xerox PARC, etc. It was also the SRI end of the original Arpanet connection with Berkeley.

Other ideas, like a keyboard that worked via "chords" didn't pan out. It made it so one hand could use the mouse and the other could use the keyboard without switching back and forth. I'm sure many folks with RSI wish for that.

I would check out the "Mother of all Demos". It's out on YouTube: https://youtu.be/yJDv-zdhzMY

And of course you can look up Englebart on Wikipedia or whatever.

And if you are interested in the topic more I recommend "What the Dormouse Said: How the Sixties Counterculture Shaped the Personal Computer Industry" by John Markoff. It plays this history out more before and after.

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