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Google’s copying of the Java SE API was fair use [pdf]

supremecourt.gov

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Re: Google’s copying of the Java SE API was fair use [pdf]

#311
Although I applaud the effect of this decision, I can't help but agree with Clarence Thomas that the reasoning behind it is not sound. It waffles back and forth between arguments for fair use and arguments that APIs are not (or at least should not be) copyrightable in the first place. You can't have it both ways. If APIs are copyrightable (and a plain reading of the text of the law appears to indicate that they are) then Google's copying was clearly not fair use. The purpose was clearly commercial, not educational or a parody. The API was not merely a fact or an idea, it was a specific embodiment that required effort to produce. And the copying clearly had a negative impact on the value of the original.

What really happened here is that the Supreme Court did an end-run around the law to paper over a major fuckup by Congress. On the one hand, I'm glad that they fixed the problem. But the way that they did it fills me with dread for the future because it undermines the rule of law.

For the record, I absolutely despise Clarence Thomas and everything that he stands for. But in this case I think he has a valid point.

Re: Google’s copying of the Java SE API was fair use [pdf]

#312
post #119

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think he's just referring to a modern version of Java the language, not ART vs HotSpot. I don't think anyone really cares which runtime is running.

The runtime prevent the support for modern JVM features such as value types (see my comment above). Google might duplicate all that work (but how much late they will be before it divide the Java world? Switching to a unified jvm and improving it through collaboration is the way to go.

But as the person I replied to, HotSpot doesn't perform as well for the use cases ART covers.

Re: Google’s copying of the Java SE API was fair use [pdf]

#314

From the dissent: > The Copyright Act expressly protects computer code. It recognizes that a “computer program” is protected by copyright... And it defines “‘computer program’” as “a set of statements or instructions to be used directly or indirectly in a computer in order to bring about a certain result.” §101. That definition clearly covers declaring code—sets of statements that indirectly perform computer function…

Agreed. I read the dissent, but not all of the majority. Do they address this point?

Re: Google’s copying of the Java SE API was fair use [pdf]

#315

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can you copyright generated things? You probably could copyright the way you're generating it, but I doubt you have a legal standing about the generated text or melody itself.

I am not a lawyer, but I don't see why not. Have you ever used code generation as part of software you have built? Is there any reason why generated code could not be copyrighted as part of a larger system? For example, suppose I define a data model for a public-facing API and then generate SDKs in various popular programming languages to interact with the public-facing API. If I were a major corporation that owned s…

We already do this, binary is generated and copyrighted.

Re: Google’s copying of the Java SE API was fair use [pdf]

#316
post #165

This is one of the most important legal decisions in the history of software. The US Supreme Court has basically just saved the whole software industry (and FOSS projects) from being wrecked by patent trolls.

Why? It wasn’t about whether APIs are under copyright (they are), but whether this particular case constitutes fair use. I think the effect of this decision was way overblown.

Justice Thomas clarifies why this case has wide-reaching impact in his dissent.

"Congress rejected categorical distinctions between declaring and implementing code. But the majority creates just such a distinction. The result of this distorting analysis is an opinion that makes it difficult to imagine any circumstance in which declaring code will remain protected by copyright."

I concur with Thomas (not in the connotation - he thinks this is a bad thing, I do not - but in the denotation). This ruling is such strong precedent that almost any API cannot be bound by copyright that no company is going to be willing to spend the money to raise the question.

Re: Google’s copying of the Java SE API was fair use [pdf]

#317
post #272
post #21

Which of Breyer's clerks drafted this? They clearly understand many tech issues and I hope they find their place on some Federal circuit to herald an era of logic in tech law. "Google’s limited copying of the API is a transformative use. Google copied only what was needed to allow programmers to work in a different computing environment without discarding a portion of a familiar programming language. Google’s purpose…

Why do you think Breyer and the other assenting justices wouldn't be able to come to this kind of decision without a clerk taking the lead?

I believe the parent commenter was highlighting the particular wording of the opinion, rather than the actual decision itself.

One could imagine an opinion supporting the same decision with less clear or precise language. As I understand the process, the opinion was frequently reviewed and advised by Breyer, but actually written by one of the clerks.

Re: Google’s copying of the Java SE API was fair use [pdf]

#318

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The argument from the text could go the other way: Congress didn't mention declarative code in the copyright act, so it's not included.

Thomas says the copyright act says any computer code called directly or indirectly. The Thomas argument is that this is an indirect use of code.

Thomas doesn't understand basic computer programming, so I wouldn't put much weight on that nuanced view.

"Indirect" here just means calling a function or jumping to some address, rather than directly inlining some statements.

For the purpose of copyright, the term "computer code" does not include the signature of that function, or the address you jump to, only the actual code statements at that destination.

Re: Google’s copying of the Java SE API was fair use [pdf]

#319
post #21

Which of Breyer's clerks drafted this? They clearly understand many tech issues and I hope they find their place on some Federal circuit to herald an era of logic in tech law. "Google’s limited copying of the API is a transformative use. Google copied only what was needed to allow programmers to work in a different computing environment without discarding a portion of a familiar programming language. Google’s purpose…

"Here the record showed that Google’s new smartphone platform is not a market substitute for Java SE."

Well that nukes it. The courts took how long to identify this precedented principle? It seems like the rest of the opinion is just there to ward off more of this tomfoolery for people that don't get it.

Re: Google’s copying of the Java SE API was fair use [pdf]

#320

From the dissent: > The Copyright Act expressly protects computer code. It recognizes that a “computer program” is protected by copyright... And it defines “‘computer program’” as “a set of statements or instructions to be used directly or indirectly in a computer in order to bring about a certain result.” §101. That definition clearly covers declaring code—sets of statements that indirectly perform computer function…

This argument is hard to swallow: > declaring code would satisfy the general test for copyrightability.. they are expressed in “words, numbers, or other verbal or numerical symbols It is common knowledge that mathematical formulae & equations, which are also expressed in words, numbers, and symbols, do not have copyright protection. > Copyright protection is therefore not available for... mathematical principles; for…

That literally is not a mathematical formula.
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