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Shopify Goes Digital by Default

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Re: Shopify Goes Digital by Default

#311
post #291

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That defeats a lot of the benefit of remote work though. My output in 3 days of work is gonna be a week's worth in my experience. Padding it with face time is mostly me eating a loss. 2 days/week working synchronously with people? Of meetings? I can't remember a time when a project I've worked on needed that to succeed.

It certainly depends on seniority and experience, the more you have the easier it is to work on your own. You don't need much guidance anymore and you know what communication and planning is needed in advance, so you can do it in batches.

Until you’re senior enough that most of your job is communication, then remote becomes difficult again. WFH now and maintaining Work/Life balance is really difficult when most of your time is spent sending emails, reviewing code and proposals and answering questions in a global company. Writing code at night happened occasionally before, but it required leaving my family and pulling out my laptop so it had to be for good reason. Helping an overseas team out over Slack with something at 11 pm can be done from my phone, “it’ll just take 5 minutes”.

Re: Shopify Goes Digital by Default

#312

If I had a really nice detached home with a wife & children then working from home permanently would be the dream. I don't. I live in a flat and live by myself. The only physical people I talk to are cashiers or delivery drivers. If your life is further on than others or you have a nightmare capital commute then I can see WFH being the way forward. But personally I like to go to the office for social interactions and…

I definitely see where you're coming from, but remember, the current situation isn't normal. I used to live by myself in an apartment working from home too. I still went out to lunch with friends and business associates. I could meet friends for drinks after work all over the area and didn't have to worry about my commute home. I'd work in co-working space, at coffee shops, on vacation, or anywhere else I wanted.

That being said, if I was in a new city with no friends or family, I would 100% want to have an office to go to.

Re: Shopify Goes Digital by Default

#313
post #295

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> ok. Why do you consider your arguments against WFH not biased and useful. Because what I'm saying is objectively true: physical colocation with your coworkers is inherently easier to work with than working remotely and no one in their right mind disputes that. The best you can argue for WFH-first is that it can be made to work. Your other clue is the choice of language. I said, for example, "I hate WFH" and (paraph…

> Because what I'm saying is objectively true: physical colocation with your coworkers is inherently easier to work with than working remotely and no one in their right mind disputes that. There are countless examples of companies large and small who have found massive amounts of success switching to a remote based methodology. Saying that this is objectively wrong and that these folks are not in "their right mind" m…

agreed...

> with your coworkers is inherently easier to work with than working remotely

This is so dependent on the coworkers. There's plenty of folks who I can work with remotely OK preciesly because we're remote. Sitting next to these people 6-8 hours per day would be extremely counter productive. I'm sure there's plenty of folks that can take me only in small doses, and 8 hrs/day of working with me face to face would be too much - I don't fault them for that!

Re: Shopify Goes Digital by Default

#314
Is it going to be a thing on HN now where the top thread for every announcement of a company embracing Remote Work will be from someone complaining about not liking Work-From-Home and 50+ replies discussing about "WFH vs office" or discussing their own personal preferences? I am starting to be astonished by the amount of supposedly-intelligent people who are completely missing the forest for the trees.

What we are witnessing might be a historical shift as big as Nixon re-opening with China, and the top comment is really complaining about some missing perks? How about start thinking of how many people who live in these big tech centers only because of their jobs and how many will just leave these cities once it is become accepted practice to work at a Canadian company while you live in the Caribbean? Or maybe start thinking that people who used to complain about H1B workers bringing the salary down now having to face competition from some random guy in Romania who can code circles around you and can accept a job at one quarter of your salary? Or how about we discuss the opportunities for startups that will come from this?

Also, start thinking if you are a VC and soon you will actually have to leave Sand Hill because no one will be crazy enough to move there to sleep on someone else's dishwasher hoping to make it big.

Personally, every announcement from an established company that is moving to a Remote-First (or Digital by Default, call it whatever you like) mentality is thrilling. Is anyone from Shopify here reading HN? I was already planning to apply for them but this announcement made me even more interested.

Re: Shopify Goes Digital by Default

#315
post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thanks for tracking. Maybe commercial real estate will have to become residential to survive the shift in demand? Economics of a skyscraper vs. residential are different, but the building still exists (I can see how not opening could be cheaper, but still, I'd like to ponder this situation.)

Whoa there silver. Just because a few tech companies are giving up their space doesn’t mean commercial office space is doomed. There are still plenty of non-tech companies and local businesses (like law firms) that I doubt will be going away. Tech companies have a huge incentive here - they can now start hiring engineers at non Bay Area prices. Which, if enough companies do it, means your salaries are at risk. Nobody…

> Just because a few tech companies are giving up their space

That hasn't happened yet either. It's more like "we're going to stop expanding".

Re: Shopify Goes Digital by Default

#316

People are going to change their tune once the paycuts start coming. There is no reason to pay SF money to someone living in the Midwest. $80k a year is comfortable most places. I hope remote first people like the suburbs and country because there is no reason to live in the city with no office. The real truth though is most people are far less productive remote because it requires proactive communication and self di…

> there is no reason to live in the city with no office Then why do so many Google/Facebook/Apple employees live in SF and commute for over an hour to the suburbs?

Because they get paid $300k/year.

Re: Shopify Goes Digital by Default

#317

People are going to change their tune once the paycuts start coming. There is no reason to pay SF money to someone living in the Midwest. $80k a year is comfortable most places. I hope remote first people like the suburbs and country because there is no reason to live in the city with no office. The real truth though is most people are far less productive remote because it requires proactive communication and self di…

If anything it'd raise the wages for people in the low cost of living areas and eventually equalize out. You can get one person making $500k in SF (plus office costs) or hire 2 or 3 people making $165-250k/each in Suburban America with no office costs. Doubtful that people will go entirely offshore due to time-zone, quality and other cultural differences, we tried that in the early 2000s when everything went to India…

I agree with this take but it's not going to be great for the SF devs that bought houses they can't afford.

Re: Shopify Goes Digital by Default

#318

I really hope this doesn't become a bigger trend. Shopify was a company I was seriously considering working at in the future, but this would probably disqualify them. Working from home once a week sounds great to me, but doing it full time would drive me insane. Virtual meetings are awful for me, and you miss out on so much of the discussion that happens outside of the meeting - I think most of the important discussi…

I too am not enjoying the 100% WFH right now.

BUT I want the flexibility to WFH 3/5 days a week. I don't mind living within an hour and a half commute, and coming in 2 days a week. Going every day... painful.

In theory I could WFH before, but as things weren't really set up for that, I only did it once a week if that.

So in that regard, I welcome this kind of thing. If companies can work out the logistics.

Re: Shopify Goes Digital by Default

#319

Earlier quoted context omitted.

“ Many people who work at these companies live in big cities where they don't have huge amounts of space and it's not conducive to being productivity, particularly if you live with other people, if you can't get some form of separation” If you have a remote first company, it means your employees can actually move somewhere that they can settle down and own a house. And yes if it’s mixed WFH and on-site then of course…

> If you have a remote first company, it means your employees can actually move somewhere that they can settle down and own a house. People don’t live in cities just for jobs. I live in the city to go to museums, art galleries, the symphony, plays, comedy shows, concerts, restaurants, happy hours etc. I have no interest in living outside the city and I especially have no interest in maintaining a house. I really want…

All of those things you mentioned exist outside of major cities.

Re: Shopify Goes Digital by Default

#320
post #160

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It might just be the current situation but I have seen maybe 4 homeless in 3 weeks in my day to day and I take a lot of walks. Could just be looking in the wrong spots but there were literally 20 tents on my block near Bart in the Mission so its an upgrade.

Found this: https://www.seattle.gov/homelessness/unauthorized-encampment... I do recall some Seattlites mentioning one specific area that is particularly bad by name but don't recall that name.

I think I heard Pioneer Square is bad, just walked there the other day and it's not anything like SFs bad areas. There could just be better options for homeless during the shutdown here than SF though. I will reserve full judgement until things are back open.

People are going to be surprised by the state of the FiDi in SF when things open back up. Many tents have gone up there with everyone gone and WFH. Going to be interesting when people go back to the office there.

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