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Tesla’s new Solar Roof costs less than a new roof plus solar panels

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Re: Tesla’s new Solar Roof costs less than a new roof plus solar panels

#311
post #309
post #308

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> “Areva, the French nuclear plant operator, offers that 70% of the cost of a kWh of nuclear electricity is accounted for by the fixed costs from the construction process.” Yes, this exactly means that operating costs are very cheap: if 70% of the cost per kWh is amortization of construction costs, and only 30% is operating costs, and the kWh from nuclear plants are still the cheapest, or exactly means that the opera…

> Which ones? What were their operating costs? “Each nuclear power plant employs 500 to 1,000 workers. Nuclear worker salaries are 20 percent higher on average than those of other electricity generation sources.” 40 mill x 50 years = 2 Billion dollars just for wages. https://www.nei.org/advantages/jobs As giant complex mechanical systems over time moving components like pumps and turbines need to be replaced. Due to…

“Each nuclear power plant employs 500 to 1,000 workers. Nuclear worker salaries are 20 percent higher on average than those of other electricity generation sources.” 40 mill x 50 years = 2 Billion dollars just for wages. https://www.nei.org/advantages/jobs"

Yes, if you multiply things by 50, you get large numbers. Note, however, that $40M per year for a plant generating 2200 MW day in day out (well, let's say 90% of the time) results in $40M / (2200 MW * 0.9 * 1 year) = $0.002 per kWh, that is, 1/5th of 1 cent per kWh in employees cost. I say that's really cheap.

> As giant complex mechanical systems over time moving components like pumps and turbines need to be replaced.

Same is true for all kinds of power plants. You need to compare the costs between all for a sensible comparison. It's fun to make all these calculations by yourself, but fortunately, there's already a metric for that, called levelised cost of electricity (LCOE). It's basically the total lifetime cost of a facility (construction, operation and decomissioning) divided by total amount of energy produced. As you can see in [1], LCOE of nuclear easily beats solar, and matches wind plants, which suffer from the disadvantage of only producing electricity when the wind blows. If you didn't have option of base load fossil or nuclear plants, you'd have to build storage for wind and solar, which would make their LCOE jump through the roof.

Look, it's clear that nuclear isn't free, so yeah, you really need to spend a billion on fuel and another on wages over 50 years. More importantly, though, over those 50 years you'll produce $50 billion worth of electricity. Just look at the published LCOEs, and consider how much they'd have to go up for solar & wind if we couldn't fall back on fossils and nuclear.

In future, if we ever manage to get off fossil fuels, the way we do it will be nuclear for base load along with some amount of wind and solar (though not much, due to environmental concerns that will make it very hard to build significant amounts of wind and solar). As I hope is clear for you, it most definitely will not be wind & solar + batteries, and no nuclear.

[1] - https://www.energy.gov/sites/prod/files/2015/08/f25/LCOE.pdf

Re: Tesla’s new Solar Roof costs less than a new roof plus solar panels

#312
post #213

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What issues? They did very few installations of previous iterations because they took a long time to install, thus were expensive. Doesn't mean there were any quality issues

https://www.businessinsider.com/tesla-solar-panel-fires-beco...

The author of this article, Linette Lopez, is a personal friend of Jim Chanos, the biggest TSLA short as far as we know. She publicly recognized this friendship and she does not care whether it makes her biased against the company. It's up to you to trust her reporting regarding these accidents and how representative her coverage is. Note that she only seeks negative feedback about Tesla products, she discard positive and neutral ones. That's her filter, an interesting one.

Re: Tesla’s new Solar Roof costs less than a new roof plus solar panels

#313
post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In the US roofs last more like 25 to 30 years for shingles.

The manufacturer states 25-30 years for shingles, but it's rarely the case they actually last that long unless you're paying for premium shingles. I'm in Canada though, so perhaps the harsher weather has something to do with that. Regardless, in Canada at least, 25-30 years for shingles is not common; 15-20 is more realistic from what I can tell in my area.

Shingles are warrantied according to their rated life time. If you buy a 25yr shingle, it'll either last 25 years or you'll get free replacements.
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