Pentagon testing mass surveillance balloons across the US • Hacker News Board

Re: Pentagon testing mass surveillance balloons across the US

#311

Post by MiroF » Tue, Aug 06, 2019, 2:48 PM UTC

Tharkun wrote: post #166

MiroF wrote: post #37

At what point do we just start a non violent movement of taping over cameras wherever we see them?

There was a camera-spotting movement in Belgium some years ago. Basically people started marking all known cameras on a map. I think people gave up once they realized the sheer impossible scope of it. Most cameras are too high up to reach anyway. A can of spray paint on a stick might be more effective, but that will almost certainly lead to vandalism charges.

Do it at night with a mask? Basically 0 chance they would catch you

Re: Pentagon testing mass surveillance balloons across the US

#312

Post by MiroF » Tue, Aug 06, 2019, 2:51 PM UTC

Trav5 wrote: post #238

senorjazz wrote: post #213

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> but what Hong Kong would be like right now if all citizens hard arms? The chinese are slowly removing democratic institutions away from the people. The people are rising up to protect them without guns. Democratic norms are slowly being eroded from the US as well. Extreme gerrymandering, electoral college / popular vote, overt foreign interference, requested foreign interference, voting irregularities, voter purges…

> does it protect the constituion? Or is more likely they become a paramilitary wing of a corrupt government? Good point, but you are lumping all gun owners into one mindset. I could definitely see that happening, but it would not be all gun owners, just a percentage. And of the many gun owners I know, the percentage that would support any government and impose anything on others would be really low.

okay but like which generally happens in countries with are level of development? definitely the paramilitary reality, not the "rise up" against government reality.

Re: Pentagon testing mass surveillance balloons across the US

#313

Post by feanaro » Thu, Aug 08, 2019, 6:39 PM UTC

boomboomsubban wrote: post #298

feanaro wrote: post #294

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How would a single person be able to choose what is best for everyone, even if benevolent? Benevolent does not mean omniscient and infinitely wise. The best kind of system is one which ensures no single entity can amass a great deal of power, ending with a state of many smaller entities in continual opposition.

>How would a single person be able to choose what is best for everyone, even if benevolent? Benevolent does not mean omniscient and infinitely wise. A benevolent dictator can still make mistakes, but so can the smaller entities you describe. The benevolent dictator would be focused on the good of everyone though, while the smaller entities in opposition would be focused on the good of their own group. The process of…

My point is that it is completely unreasonable to expect a single entity to even approach the optimum for the majority of people, unless this entity is god-like. The numerous smaller entities simply have a lot more manageable task ahead of them.

By distributing power into a large number of entities, there is no power consolidation and hence no single point of failure. With such a power structure, it is much harder for a sociopath to replace the benevolent dictator and take control of the whole. Furthermore, if any of the smaller entities go awry, an individual can much more easily migrate to another one.

Re: Pentagon testing mass surveillance balloons across the US

#314

Post by brokenmachine » Mon, Aug 12, 2019, 12:05 AM UTC

brokenmachine wrote: post #309

m3kw9 wrote: post #40

To those that are profound, the US has mass surveillance since the first satellite with camera was in orbit

I found it really interesting when that link came up on HN recently of a spy telescope taken by an amateur. Can't find the story now unfortunately. I knew the Hubble was cool, but on that page it mentioned that this telescope was one of ten that the military had pointed at the Earth that are now deprecated. Imagine what they have now that is even better than ten Hubbles.

Found the link: https://www.universetoday.com/65458/spying-on-a-hubble-teles...

Re: Pentagon testing mass surveillance balloons across the US

#315

Post by boomboomsubban » Wed, Aug 14, 2019, 7:19 AM UTC

feanaro wrote: post #313

boomboomsubban wrote: post #298

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>How would a single person be able to choose what is best for everyone, even if benevolent? Benevolent does not mean omniscient and infinitely wise. A benevolent dictator can still make mistakes, but so can the smaller entities you describe. The benevolent dictator would be focused on the good of everyone though, while the smaller entities in opposition would be focused on the good of their own group. The process of…

My point is that it is completely unreasonable to expect a single entity to even approach the optimum for the majority of people, unless this entity is god-like. The numerous smaller entities simply have a lot more manageable task ahead of them. By distributing power into a large number of entities, there is no power consolidation and hence no single point of failure. With such a power structure, it is much harder fo…

>My point is that it is completely unreasonable to expect a single entity to even approach the optimum for the majority of people, unless this entity is god-like. The numerous smaller entities simply have a lot more manageable task ahead of them.

With multiple groups, approaching the "optimum" will eventually involve hurting other groups for the benefit of your own. To me, everybody living adequately is preferred to some living optimally at the expense of others.

The rest of your post is about the nigh impossibility of setting up a benevolent dictatorship. It absolutely should not be attempted, even if it would be the ideal form of government.