Amazon rolls out machines that pack orders and replace jobs • Hacker News Board

Re: Amazon rolls out machines that pack orders and replace jobs

#311

Post by JMTQp8lwXL » Mon, May 13, 2019, 5:40 PM UTC

elamje wrote: post #301

Articles about Amazon are quick to mention the workplace conditions or robots automating something. Rarely do they mention that machines equal lower prices for the consumers 9 times out of 10. You can think what you want about Amazon but I’m not complaining that I have 100’s of options for my phone case, all for 1/5 the price of the previous days buying them at Verizon or Apple. Edit: would be awesome to hear about A…

It seems less relevant to compare the cost of a case at Verizon/Apple than purchasing through Amazon. Why? It's a completely different experience -- you get to see the selection in person, ask questions, try the case on your phone to confirm it actually fits, you know there is near-0 odds of it being a counterfeit or unscrupulous seller (unlike Amazon).

The mort apt comparison is the cost of the phone case when packed with human labor vs. packed by robots.

Re: Amazon rolls out machines that pack orders and replace jobs

#312

Post by o_p » Mon, May 13, 2019, 5:41 PM UTC

elamje wrote: post #301

Articles about Amazon are quick to mention the workplace conditions or robots automating something. Rarely do they mention that machines equal lower prices for the consumers 9 times out of 10. You can think what you want about Amazon but I’m not complaining that I have 100’s of options for my phone case, all for 1/5 the price of the previous days buying them at Verizon or Apple. Edit: would be awesome to hear about A…

>machines bring lower prices

Do you have any source about this? If the costumer is already willing to pay a price there would be no point in lowering the price just because you automated the process. Or better said, theres no point in investing in machines if your profit margin is not going to get wider.

Re: Amazon rolls out machines that pack orders and replace jobs

#313

Post by c0vfefe » Mon, May 13, 2019, 5:41 PM UTC

smpetrey wrote: post #303

Anyone parading around like this is bad news has never worked in an assembly line or warehouse job. This might reduce the workforce overall long-term, but honestly this is hard back-breaking long-workday labor. Anything that improves the livelihood of the warehouse workers is a win in my book.

Snap jobs out of existence so the workers don't have to suffer by doing them - Thanos would approve!

Re: Amazon rolls out machines that pack orders and replace jobs

#314

Post by Veelox » Mon, May 13, 2019, 5:41 PM UTC

dfilppi wrote: post #259

Cool. After all Amazon's product isn't "jobs". It is customer service, and robots are better.

Agreed also, these jobs involved putting items in boxes for 8+ hours. These are exactly the kind of mind numbing jobs where robots are great.

Re: Amazon rolls out machines that pack orders and replace jobs

#315

Post by katakuchi » Mon, May 13, 2019, 5:41 PM UTC

Jobs are changing, the skills we require of the working force is in constant flux. We pretend like this is a catastrophe, while we should be thanking progression and embracing development that improves production which no longer requires humans to do such mundane jobs.

The friction and disruption the abrupt rollout of such machines might cause is a different matter. We should take a long hard look how we want to re-educate or re-employ the workforce which is currently on jobs such as retail sales, factory workers or even drivers.

New developments also introduce new jobs, last I've heard the western population is also aging. And there are still huge gaps in sectors such as education, nursing. Whatever drives the population will definitely create a new demand in work-intense labour. It's needed to keep the economic wheel turning.

Re: Amazon rolls out machines that pack orders and replace jobs

#316

Post by c0vfefe » Mon, May 13, 2019, 5:42 PM UTC

tomc1985 wrote: post #300

dfilppi wrote: post #259

Cool. After all Amazon's product isn't "jobs". It is customer service, and robots are better.

Such a shame that this is the top comment here. People at that level are watching their job options shrink at an incredible place. Qualify your statement; robots are only "better" because they are cheaper.

For certain tasks, robots are also faster, safer & produce higher quality, as the automotive industry has demonstrated.

Re: Amazon rolls out machines that pack orders and replace jobs

#317

Post by wffurr » Mon, May 13, 2019, 5:43 PM UTC

mschuster91 wrote: post #218

blairanderson wrote: post #168

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You mentioned two processes that have been in place with Amazon Vendors/Manufacturers for many years. 1. Amazon Direct Fulfillment (dropship): Order is shipped directly from the manufacturer to the customer. Amazon pays for the shipping label and contractually "own" the item once it leaves the MFR doors. Amazon incentivizes Manufacturers by paying the freight and loosening shipment deadlines. [1] 2. Ships In Own Cont…

> Ships In Own Container (Amazon SIOC) certification puts the responsibility on the manufacturer to certify their products can be shipped without extra packaging. Sorry, but how can this be a good idea? I'd hate if I ordered something expensive, for example a digital camera, and every porch pirate (or shady parcel delivery subcontractor) immediately sees "this thing is worth a couple grand", compared with the usual A…

If you're worried about porch pirates - use a locker instead. They're already stealing some of your packages anyway.

Shady subcontractors are Amazon's problem.

Re: Amazon rolls out machines that pack orders and replace jobs

#318

Post by EpicEng » Mon, May 13, 2019, 5:43 PM UTC

sim_card_map wrote: post #253

sokoloff wrote: post #187

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm a UBI supporter in theory. It's the practical math that always leaves me hung up. Even $600/mo/adult citizen is a seemingly prohibitive amount of money (works out to approximately the entire amount of all individual income tax payments, or about half of total receipts, including FICA). And of course, $600/mo/adult is an extremely meager existence.

If we take all the money the Netherlands spends on social security, welfare, pensions, etc, and add extra money from increased taxes (make it flat 50-60%), every single household can have a UBI of about 42 000 euros/year. The numbers are similar for other western economies.

>add extra money from increased taxes (make it flat 50-60%)

Good luck passing a bill that raises my effective tax rate from 17% to 55%. Obviously if you take a whole lot more money from everyone else there will be more to hand out to others.

Re: Amazon rolls out machines that pack orders and replace jobs

#319

Post by tomc1985 » Mon, May 13, 2019, 5:43 PM UTC

rkho wrote: post #309

tomc1985 wrote: post #300

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Such a shame that this is the top comment here. People at that level are watching their job options shrink at an incredible place. Qualify your statement; robots are only "better" because they are cheaper.

I'm not in full agreement here. Having spent nearly a decade in customer service, I've found that it requires: + Lots of empathy + The willingness to learn and be wrong + A ton of training Even then, human-based customer service is still subjected to the whims of: + Gut checks + Power trips + Misinformation/misinterpretation of policy (whether intentional or not) + Lots of emotion on both sides of the interaction Not…

On the flipside, I hate nearly every non-human interaction introduced in the last few years that I have to make. With the exception of withdrawing money from an ATM (later edit- and some kinds of online shopping), automated customer service experiences have always been worse, mostly because they always seem to be programmed with a very narrow and optimistic set of goals in mind. Life would be even more of a hell if I couldn't mash 0 to speak to an operator in a lot of cases; as it is that option is already hidden.

There isn't a lot of good reason to be optimistic about the future either; chatbots and fast food kiosks were a flop (and rightfully so) and most of these other styles of interaction feel forced and constricting.

Humans may have their flaws but you can't beat the fact that they're what other humans are comfortable around.

Re: Amazon rolls out machines that pack orders and replace jobs

#320

Post by edanm » Mon, May 13, 2019, 5:46 PM UTC

o_p wrote: post #312

elamje wrote: post #301

Articles about Amazon are quick to mention the workplace conditions or robots automating something. Rarely do they mention that machines equal lower prices for the consumers 9 times out of 10. You can think what you want about Amazon but I’m not complaining that I have 100’s of options for my phone case, all for 1/5 the price of the previous days buying them at Verizon or Apple. Edit: would be awesome to hear about A…

>machines bring lower prices Do you have any source about this? If the costumer is already willing to pay a price there would be no point in lowering the price just because you automated the process. Or better said, theres no point in investing in machines if your profit margin is not going to get wider.

Sure there is. If they don't do it, someone else will be able to outcompete on price, eventually at least.

And yes, most of our history is full of examples of newer technologies lowering cost, that's kind of the whole reason that or civilization is more advanced (materially) than it was in the past.