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Dotfile madness

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Re: Dotfile madness

#311
post #268

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Associating tags with files is straight forward. What's not quite so straight forward is how you query the system. The worst implementations of file tagging only implement retrieving a list of all files that have a given tag. Slightly better than this are tagging systems that will return the intersection between two or more tags. Most tag systems never go beyond this. Going slightly further, tag exclusions are powerf…

Wasn’t this the whole idea and purpose of the successor to NTFS which was supposed to ship with Longhorn/Vista? What happened there?

WinFS. I don't know much about it, but I understand it was to have some properties similar to what I've described.

Re: Dotfile madness

#312
post #252

The real problem is that any app I run accesss all files I own with equal permissions. App1 and App2 shouldn’t write their data to my home, or read each other’s data, or, please, be able to write each other’s data. A video game can read my tax forms. WTF. Mobile & tablet OSs solve this. Everything has to follow. Until then, basically every app should run in a docker container. Then it can do what it wants.

You can create another user and sudo / gksudo to it when working on sensitive data. It never occurred to me before reading your comment. I could start doing it myself.

su - also works.

Indeed the capability exists (unix/linux pioneered it?), but it relies on manual containment by the user. It should be automated, with prompts at install or execution time, like on mobile OSs.

An idea is each file should have its own user, basically, with both relative and absolute file creation/modification permissions. If you run an arbitrary executable as a user there's great security risk since it can do anything you can (without sudo of course).

It seems like the natural progression from

Run everything as root ->

Separate root and day-to-day user ->

Don't use root and achieve things with sudo ->

Each file has its own permissions (i.e. essentially its own user) set by the parent user

Permissions should be both for individual actions and permanent classes of actions, on the user's discretion (i.e. allow it to create this file or always allow it to create files)

This approach is even naturally hierarchical, executables could create other executables as long as they have permission to do so, and set the child permissions to at most its own. In this context an executable asking for permissions can be akin to sudo: it really is a file-user asking for its parent file-user for expanded permissions.

To give a real life allegory, consider a Technician in a company wants to make a tool purchase, so he asks the Engineer. The Engineer doesn't have permission, so he denies or asks the Manager. Finally the Manager either denies or asks the CEO which has permission over everything.

Re: Dotfile madness

#313
post #137

Oddly I feel completely the opposite about this topic. I think dot files in your home directory are exactly the way to go. Using the XDG standard leaves you with whatever the distro decides is the correct location for these files. While their recommendation is all in the home directory, I wouldn't put it past some of these distro developers to make some crazy /var/users/{uid}/config directory. This is important when…

> Using the XDG standard leaves you with whatever the distro decides is the correct location for these files.

This is not true. Even if the distribution sets global xdg variables (none that I've come across do) - the user can always override them.

> While their recommendation is all in the home directory, I wouldn't put it past some of these distro developers to make some crazy /var/users/{uid}/config directory

This sounds like a strawman. Are you aware of any existing distros doing this? Users don't have write access to system directories in the vast majority of distributions.

Re: Dotfile madness

#314

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Save games is a poor example. Users often need to back them up. Backup systems often include Documents by default but not AppData. Files in AppData are hidden, and you would not expect users to find them. Further, many save games can be opened with a text editor just fine :)

As noted below there's a special folder called "Saved Games" that's specifically meant for this purpose. A lot of games still don't use it.

And here I am, still wanting my save files to reside next to the games exe...

Re: Dotfile madness

#315
post #252

The real problem is that any app I run accesss all files I own with equal permissions. App1 and App2 shouldn’t write their data to my home, or read each other’s data, or, please, be able to write each other’s data. A video game can read my tax forms. WTF. Mobile & tablet OSs solve this. Everything has to follow. Until then, basically every app should run in a docker container. Then it can do what it wants.

There's a very simple solution to this: Don't run apps that you don't trust. If you simply must , use a VM or AppArmor or SELinux. Don't inconvenience everybody because you're too lazy to be responsible for your own data. Besides, untrustworthy apps will bypass the protections anyway. Judging by the popularity of "curl | sudo bash" lately, they'll probably just ask for root directly.

I have some degree of distrust of most of my applications. The "open trust" model usually ends up getting abused to the point where we have to lock it down...like early Windows, wide open for easy of administration, leading to things like the notorious "Blaster" worm, or the open architecture of the Internet, where we now have massive spam and DNS amplification attacks and all sorts of problems based on the notion of a trustworthy network.

In general, everything in computing will keep going in the direction of "trust everything as little as possible for it to do its job" forever, I think, and probably has to.

Re: Dotfile madness

#316
https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2017/04/why-is-...

https://www.newsweek.com/2016/06/17/silicon-valley-takeover-...

https://medium.com/@preethikasireddy/why-im-leaving-silicon-...

https://getlighthouse.com/blog/silicon-valley-bad-managers/

https://www.philanthropy.com/article/A-Star-Performer-Create...

https://www.theglobeandmail.com/report-on-business/internati...

https://www.geekwire.com/2018/emily-chang-brotopia-silicon-v...

https://www.entrepreneur.com/article/297481

https://thenextweb.com/insider/2017/03/11/bro-culture-poison...

https://www.quora.com/Is-the-culture-in-the-Silicon-Valley-b...

https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2016/06/ellen-pao-memoir-sil...

https://www.recode.net/2018/2/5/16972096/emily-chang-brotopi...

https://www.glassdoor.com/Reviews/Silicon-Valley-Community-F...

https://www.wired.com/story/everyone-hates-silicon-valley-ex...

https://www.intelligencesquaredus.org/debates/silicon-valley...

https://yourstory.com/2017/07/silicon-valley-bro-culture/

https://www.wsj.com/articles/the-quiet-efforts-to-battle-sil...

https://thebolditalic.com/a-source-of-sorrow-in-silicon-vall...

https://www.bizjournals.com/sanfrancisco/news/2019/01/25/is-...

https://www.rawstory.com/2018/07/silicon-valley-become-next-...

https://builttoadapt.io/so-you-want-to-build-a-silicon-valle...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h3-bMDaMhLg

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/mar/01/silicon-valley...

https://www.indiewire.com/2018/07/silicon-valley-actress-ali...!

https://www.theneweconomy.com/technology/silicons-sexist-bro...

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17051800

https://www.losaltosonline.com/news/sections/schools/210-sch...

Re: Dotfile madness

#317

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is particularly weird, since click (snap's "predecessor" at Canonical/Ubuntu) was fully XDG compliant, even encouraging developers to separate data from cache etc. (unlike flatpak which just dumps everything in ~/.local/share/[...], though that is still infinitely better than using ~/snap).

I personally don't like xdg. I have bin files from pip and other stuff in ~/.local/bin. I have huge amounts of cache files in both .cache and .config. It's supposed to make my life easier by being able to backup .config and dump everything. but in reality this doesnt happen. Backing up .config for just the user defined configs is a massive PITA. you have to put so many gitignore exceptions and I'm not even talking ab…

> you have to put so many gitignore exceptions and I'm not even talking about the gigs of data all the chromium derivatives put into that folder

Yeah but chrome devs half-assing the trivial xdg spec doesn't mean that xdg sucks - its just not implemented properly.

Re: Dotfile madness

#318

I'll take dotfile madness over registry madness. I have been trying to figure out where in the registry Visual Studio 2015 puts its install location so I can remove that registry value when I reinstall it to put it in it's default location. So far I've wasted a ton of time trying to accomplish this. A single file .VS2015 would be preferable.

There is a program for windows that does this if I recall correctly. It records every file and registry entry created during installation and allows you to compare snapshots of "before" and "after" installation.

Re: Dotfile madness

#319
post #288

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Python did this until very recently too. Windows has a problem, because people expect to use those programs in the command line and the %PATH% has a size limit and is a bit difficult to set-up properly.

I always add C:\U to my Path and store all standalone executable programs to C:\U I also have C:\CMD for my own batch files. Every single program should be fully contained in its own directory including all the settings,logging,configuration etc... No touching of any common resource or repository. It should be enough to delete single tree to fully uninstall program with all the garbage it created along the way

Most people like to separatly store data and executables for good reasons.

Re: Dotfile madness

#320

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Save games is a poor example. Users often need to back them up. Backup systems often include Documents by default but not AppData. Files in AppData are hidden, and you would not expect users to find them. Further, many save games can be opened with a text editor just fine :)

I understand not backing up AppData/Local, but everything in AppData/Roaming is supposedly important enough to sync it over the network (if you use domains or another mechanism to give you the same Windows account on multiple computers). Any default policy which doesn't back up AppData/Roaming seems ill advised.

It's ill advised to synchronize game saves by default. Quite a few popular games generate gigabytes of saves.

My witcher saves were 10GB, until I realize that problem and deleted them, no wounder backups were slow. Skyrim is not that far off.

Pretty sure backup is already integrated in steam for these two games.

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