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PHP 7 Released

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Re: PHP 7 Released

#311

Post by treeface »

lostsock wrote: post #297
Zelphyr wrote: post #172

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Until you hit something the framework wasn't design to do (which happens 100% of the time in my experience). Now you're working for the framework instead of it working for you. This guy said it better: “Frameworks invert control. They control the lifecycle of the app, and give you entry points where your code runs. You’re still responsible for the final code, but you’re not in control.” https://aerotwist.com/blog/the…

Can you give an example of something you would like to do that a framework like Laravel won't let you do or you feel like you have to fight against?

Yeah, I hear that argument a lot from people who don't understand how the service container works. Laravel is really quite easy to understand if you have a decent knowledge of PHP. You can replace entire chunks of the framework for basically no cost if you want something to work differently.

Re: PHP 7 Released

#312

Post by wtetzner »

TazeTSchnitzel wrote: post #295
feld wrote: post #243

Earlier quoted context omitted.

and if you do this you deserve to burn in a fiery pit for being a bad bad bad release manager If you tag a commit you better stick to your guns and never change it. You can't just re-tag or re-roll your releases because you found a bug. Bugs happen. Increment your version number, cut/tag a new release, and move on. You will never have a perfect release. Ever.

Tagging a PHP release doesn't mean finalising it. That's when the tarballs go up and the email goes out.

Yes, but moving a tag is very bad. A tag is meant to be an immutable pointer into a repo.

If you create a php-7.0.0 tag, and you find a bad bug, then make a new tag, either php-7.0.1, or since you might still want to call the release PHP 7.0.0, maybe name it php-7.0.0-bugfix1 or something.

Re: PHP 7 Released

#313

Post by wtetzner »

motiejus wrote: post #157

OK, great! Clicking the main page[1], see the top of README: "build error". Wait, what? You just released it, it should definitely work! Clicking that icon[2], checking the failed build[3]: ERROR: no certificate subject alternative name matches requested host name `pear.php.net'. To connect to pear.php.net insecurely, use `--no-check-certificate'. Really? See what's in http://pear.php.net/ > The server running pear.p…

> % openssl s_client -connect pear.php.net:443 ... Certificate chain 0 s:/CN=mail.cweiske.de

>So you're using CN=mail.cweiske.de for pear.php.net. I don't even know what to say.. Well, happy hacking!

Yeah, but it's cool that they used Let's Encrypt.

Re: PHP 7 Released

#314

Post by Practicality »

timdavila wrote: post #286
Practicality wrote: post #139

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We will be going live with v7 as soon as I test it on the dev servers, so probably this week. Not everyone is so slow.

Who is we?

My business has a set of 4 public websites that run (mostly) on PHP. As the lead developer it is up to me (in this company) to decide when we upgrade.

Re: PHP 7 Released

#315

Post by imaginenore »

trm42 wrote: post #7

PHP 7 makes life a lot better for PHP devs in many ways but one awesome thing is it obsoletes bunch of out-of-date tutorials by finally removing the old Mysql extension \o/ http://php.net/manual/en/migration70.removed-exts-sapis.php I actually met a young aspiring web developer who still learned DB-access with mysql_* functions. I urged him to switch to a sane framework like Laravel. Oh boy he was happy in a month an…

The problem with Laravel is, while being a sane framework, it absolutely kills the performance, especially the last version, which is now slower than Symfony.

http://blog.a-way-out.net/blog/2015/03/27/php-framework-benc...

Re: PHP 7 Released

#316

Post by jjuhl »

MAGZine wrote: post #309
jjuhl wrote: post #277

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It may solve your immediate problem. But it's dangerous - there are too many hidden gotchas and situations where you have to know the actual implementation (which can change) to know what it does. It also breaks a lot of conventions established by most other languages, so you really have to be really careful when assuming that "this probably works like I expect" - you may get nasty surprises). Ohh and it's pretty slo…

Yikes. PHP's architecture is highly discussed in their mailing lists. If you have such a problem with the language, why don't you just jump in and show everyone the light? I can't believe that you're still talking about things from 2007 or the horribly outdated fractal of bad design article. It's nearly 2016, do things not change in tech over the course of 4 years?

When we are talking about PHP I'd tend towards "no". The only thing I trust them to do reliably is "fuck stuff up and get things wrong". They've proven very capable at that over the years and I don't see anything changing that.

Re: PHP 7 Released

#317

Post by MrBra »

When years ago I started learning Ruby and wanted to use it for the web, my intention was using it like you do with PHP (simply including it in HTML) but I got a bit frustrated because all the resources I kept finding showed the only way of using Ruby in a web context was by using a big framework like Rails or, by choosing a wrong path and playing with stuff which required a lot more in depth knowledge that I did not have (and that I didn't want to be forced to have because I just wanted to focus on app code and experiment).

I only recently discovered https://github.com/migrs/rack-server-pages which allows to simply shove Ruby in HTML the same way as PHP and as a new Ruby dev could expect to be able to do. I think this approach makes learning projects simpler, and at the same has the added value of making people actually learn a lot about those aspects of HTTP that frameworks keep well hidden under their carpet and that can help you become a good web developer instead of "simply" a framework user.

Yes for sure, best practices that frameworks implement are there for a reason, and it's great to have them, but IMHO, this approach has advantages when learning and could also be seen as an essential step to understand what those frameworks you will use next are abstracting and why.

IMHO, what still contributes to new generations of devs approaching PHP, is also its immediateness and simplicity with nothing to do except '' and with this comment I just wanted to give a bit more exposure to the fact that a similar solution exists for Ruby too, and that it's a bit of a pity that because of the importance of Rails it got a bit overshadowed.

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