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Data centers trigger voter backlash

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Re: Data centers trigger voter backlash

#301

Post by godwinson__4-8 »

xp84 wrote: post #210
godwinson__4-8 wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

You're making a huge assumption there that UBI would be implemented successfully. On paper it sounds great to me, but if it's not done incredibly skillfully, UBI would just be a fast track to Zimbabwe-style economic ruin, except instead of just producing humorous-looking banknotes for the rest of the world, I'm pretty sure complete economic collapse of the US would have... a few pretty bad knock-on effects on most ot…

You bring up some great points. It will not be easy. That's why it would be nice if there was more serious talk around it so the economic and social issues could be discussed and planned for. Right now no one seems to be planning for anything except more mega returns and IPOs and disruption until the music stops. It would be nice if our society could get ahead of problems instead of merely being reactive to them. America has pulled off daunting challenges and social transformations before. A positive outlook that acknowledged the reality of AI vs a reactionary chant against the data center would be welcome. It's not like the status quo is desirable.

Re: Data centers trigger voter backlash

#302

Post by AngryData »

qurren wrote: post #294
miiiiiike wrote: post #276

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What a bad idea AI therapy is and I don’t know too many people who are using AI art commercially. Translators, sure. But we’ve been using Google Translate for almost two decades now. You didn’t need AI for your plumbing. My dad had a whole set of books on household chores that we used to fix everything. I do more of the work around my house than most. I won’t touch tall trees to fuck with my breaker box. I do most of…

> What a bad idea AI therapy is People will use it, because they don't have money for real therapists, because they also lost their own job. Maybe you can give them free therapy if you think it's a bad idea? > I don’t know too many people who are using AI art commercially I see AI stock images absolutely everywhere in the news now, AI portraits all over the place, AI relit product images absolutely everywhere. > You…

You don't have to read the entire book to figure out your one problem, that is what the index is for. Also you could of googled your problem 10 years ago and found the same answer with what, an extra 10 seconds?

Re: Data centers trigger voter backlash

#303

Post by sidewndr46 »

adamsb6 wrote: post #135
thewillowcat wrote: post #93

I can tell you, based on local examples, that politicians are setting up deals to bring in data centers without trying to build community support first. Not only that, they are often signing NDAs that prohibit them from telling voters what they have agreed to. It's no way to operate in a democracy, and voters are right to be angry.

I’m a voter who prefers we establish rules that be followed rather than encumber every project with a lengthy community dialogue.

That'd pretty much defeat the point of having local government. If politicians can't get their hand in the cookie jar, what's the point?

Re: Data centers trigger voter backlash

#304

Post by AngryData »

miiiiiike wrote: post #261
watwut wrote: post #252

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What is the benefit? They provide no jobs and demand tax cuts.

Property taxes. Construction jobs. The land is unused and already had tax incentives. Remember, tax incentives don’t eliminate taxes, they just reduce them for a period of time to encourage development.

Many of these data centers are demanding tax breaks from the local governments, so taxes isn't a great excuse. The construction jobs are a one off deal, most of which will be done by non-local firms that specialize in large construction projects that don't exist in areas with "unused land". And then you also have to account for the higher power costs people in the area will be paying which is just another subsidy to big business on top of the stack of them that area already paid out to big business.

Re: Data centers trigger voter backlash

#305

Post by redsocksfan45 »

thewillowcat wrote: post #93

I can tell you, based on local examples, that politicians are setting up deals to bring in data centers without trying to build community support first. Not only that, they are often signing NDAs that prohibit them from telling voters what they have agreed to. It's no way to operate in a democracy, and voters are right to be angry.

[dead]

Re: Data centers trigger voter backlash

#306

Post by AngryData »

cobbzilla wrote: post #257
multjoy wrote: post #241

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Metal and food are useful, though.

the irony of making an implied point that data centers aren’t useful, by using data centers.

Pretty sure hackernews doesn't take a giant datacenter to run. Its a text-only website managed by nerds. If HN didn't care about redundancy they could probably host it out of somebody's basement.

Re: Data centers trigger voter backlash

#307

Post by _DeadFred_ »

jnwatson wrote: post #281
thewillowcat wrote: post #246

Earlier quoted context omitted.

These companies aren't coming in, buying property at market rates, and developing it with existing infrastructure under current zoning laws. They usually want tax breaks, major infrastructure changes, and other accommodations and guarantees. It's completely reasonable for people to want a dialog with their representatives before those kinds of arrangements are made with a company on their behalf. And it's entirely re…

A meeting to get a lamp post change is exactly how progress stops. It is why we can't build anything in US and it costs a billion dollars per mile of high speed rail.

Communities passed and paid bonds to have water hookusp. Built infrastructure. They should have a say in who gets access and why. There are plenty of places datacenters could build without hassle, but they want access to readymade infra, and that comes with a reasonable tradeoff.

Re: Data centers trigger voter backlash

#308

Post by AngryData »

jesse_dot_id wrote: post #122
pesus wrote: post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're right, but that doesn't mean opinions will evolve towards viewing the technology more positively. With AI, it's increasingly the opposite.

It's already speeding up medical progress, so it'll probably take roughly however much time it takes for you to be personally affected by something that is currently incurable.

Not everyone thinks they will or wants to live forever, and that is assuming they could even afford to get that care. I can't afford to get the best care there is available right now. Im certainly not going to get even better care when my costs go up and my wages go down.

Re: Data centers trigger voter backlash

#309

Post by AngryData »

anthonypasq wrote: post #172
amanaplanacanal wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How does a new datacenter help the voters? All they see is that their electricity prices are going to go up.

why do we give a shit what voters think should happen on someone else's property again?

Because what your neighbors do on their property effects you on your property. That is why zoning and permitting exists.

Re: Data centers trigger voter backlash

#310

Post by downrightmike »

ToucanLoucan wrote: post #134
cogman10 wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> no one I know gives a shit about the energy consumption or water usage. They do when the knowledge of the resource consumption is paired with "Which will directly lead to your electric/gas bill going up." People are also paying attention to the fact that the politicians aren't paying attention to the people. Nobody is even trying to sell the benefits of a datacenter in people's backyard. Instead, politicians are be…

I think it's less about what data centers are and more about what they represent. * The lack of care of governments of the people's will: they're opposed nearly everywhere but city governments get them done anyway, oftentimes while ignoring more important local problems * The intrusion of the wealthy/big tech into people's lives. Large tech companies tend to be like insurance companies: they just appear out of the et…

Utah is looking at 3 gigawatts to start and 9GW when operating, the state uses 4 GW, and they are choosing to tell residents that their service will be shut off to support the datacenter.
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