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Anthropic says OpenClaw-style Claude CLI usage is allowed again

docs.openclaw.ai

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Re: Anthropic says OpenClaw-style Claude CLI usage is allowed again

#301

Post by camkego »

skapadia wrote: post #262

Basically, as long as you are using an Anthropic library or tool, you can use your OAuth credentials. For example, you can use the Claude Agent SDK with your OAuth credentials. This is sweet because I can prototype all sorts of agents with Claude Code embedded inside, at a predictable monthly cost. One nice use case is turning skills into standalone tools or apps. You can also do convoluted things like run Claude Cod…

The way I read the Anthropic docs, it seems the term plan is to block the usage of OAuth credentials with the "Claude Agent SDK".

This URL: https://code.claude.com/docs/en/agent-sdk/overview

Says this: "Unless previously approved, Anthropic does not allow third party developers to offer claude.ai login or rate limits for their products, including agents built on the Claude Agent SDK. Please use the API key authentication methods described in this document instead."

Again, it seems Anthropic prefers to bill API token rates (long run), not subscriber effective token rates.

Re: Anthropic says OpenClaw-style Claude CLI usage is allowed again

#303

Post by nopointttt »

joshstrange wrote: post #192

Well that's clear as mud. I've complained, extensively, about this before but Anthropic really needs to make it clear what is and is not supported with or without a subscription. Until then, it's hard to know where you stand with using their products. I say all of this as someone who doesn't use OpenClaw or any Claw-like product currently. I just want to know what I can and can't do and currently it's impossible to k…

There's a technical reason the stance is so vague. Claude CLI works if you reuse its session token, works behind ANTHROPIC_BASE_URL, works wrapped in a shell script. Anthropic sees the same telemetry either way. To draw a firm line they'd have to cap what the CLI does, or ship a policy file the tooling can actually check, and both are a real investment. I read the current fog as them being honest about that rather than being evasive. It's still annoying.

Re: Anthropic says OpenClaw-style Claude CLI usage is allowed again

#304

Post by LatencyKills »

doginasuit wrote: post #288
LatencyKills wrote: post #205

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I find it a little bizarre that people have this expectation. Well, enough people complained that Anthropic reversed their stance. Additionally, their primary competitor doesn't have any compute restrictions, which should help clarify why this decision was made. As someone who has been building ML/AI tools (@ MS & Apple) for almost 25 years, I can say that much of the value of the underlying model comes from the ha…

I'm inclined to agree for that price. Is there something the 200/month subscription gets you that the API doesn't? I still don't know why creating an API key and loading it up with $200 every month is an unfavorable option. Do you expect it would cost more? You might even end up paying less, especially if you can find ways to make it more efficient given that you are using a bespoke harness. I still feel like I'm mis…

> I still don't know why creating an API key and loading it up with $200 every month is an unfavorable option.

If I pay $200/month for a Max subscription, I can access ALL of Anthropic's tools (CC, Design, Cowork, etc.).

If I pay $200/month for API access, then the only thing I can use is the API.

You don't see how ridiculous that is? No other SOTA model company has these restrictions, which is why Anthropic keeps losing subscribers.

Re: Anthropic says OpenClaw-style Claude CLI usage is allowed again

#305

Post by skapadia »

Cidan wrote: post #265
skapadia wrote: post #262

Basically, as long as you are using an Anthropic library or tool, you can use your OAuth credentials. For example, you can use the Claude Agent SDK with your OAuth credentials. This is sweet because I can prototype all sorts of agents with Claude Code embedded inside, at a predictable monthly cost. One nice use case is turning skills into standalone tools or apps. You can also do convoluted things like run Claude Cod…

You don't really need to tmux at all for Claude Code CLI. Claude Code CLI supports streaming json input, and streaming json output; you can use stdin/out as a pipe to control Claude Code CLI. I'm doing this today in https://github.com/Cidan/ask -- works great.

This is awesome. Thank you for pointing out streaming JSON input and output, I'll definitely be taking a look at that.

Re: Anthropic says OpenClaw-style Claude CLI usage is allowed again

#306

Post by doginasuit »

LatencyKills wrote: post #304
doginasuit wrote: post #288

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm inclined to agree for that price. Is there something the 200/month subscription gets you that the API doesn't? I still don't know why creating an API key and loading it up with $200 every month is an unfavorable option. Do you expect it would cost more? You might even end up paying less, especially if you can find ways to make it more efficient given that you are using a bespoke harness. I still feel like I'm mis…

> I still don't know why creating an API key and loading it up with $200 every month is an unfavorable option. If I pay $200/month for a Max subscription, I can access ALL of Anthropic's tools (CC, Design, Cowork, etc.). If I pay $200/month for API access, then the only thing I can use is the API. You don't see how ridiculous that is? No other SOTA model company has these restrictions, which is why Anthropic keeps lo…

> You don't see how ridiculous that is? No other SOTA model company has these restrictions

You cannot use a ChatGPT subscription with a CLI tool, if you want to build your own harness you have to go through the API. I'm unsure about Gemini. Claude Code seems to be a special case because it is itself a CLI tool and so it becomes much easier to build a custom harness around, but its not surprising or unusual that it would have restrictions.

Subscription products normally have terms of use that limit how you use it that are shaped by the infrastructure they rely on. A harness is often tuned to usage that fits with the constraints of the service, the backend that supports the tool is engineered for that usage. A custom harness could easily bypass that tuning and become unsustainable.

On top of that, the API tends to be a much more flexible product to use directly. I can understand why you'd have more expectations paying for the max product, but this doesn't sound unusual or unreasonable to me.

Re: Anthropic says OpenClaw-style Claude CLI usage is allowed again

#307

Post by LatencyKills »

doginasuit wrote: post #306
LatencyKills wrote: post #304

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I still don't know why creating an API key and loading it up with $200 every month is an unfavorable option. If I pay $200/month for a Max subscription, I can access ALL of Anthropic's tools (CC, Design, Cowork, etc.). If I pay $200/month for API access, then the only thing I can use is the API. You don't see how ridiculous that is? No other SOTA model company has these restrictions, which is why Anthropic keeps lo…

> You don't see how ridiculous that is? No other SOTA model company has these restrictions You cannot use a ChatGPT subscription with a CLI tool, if you want to build your own harness you have to go through the API. I'm unsure about Gemini. Claude Code seems to be a special case because it is itself a CLI tool and so it becomes much easier to build a custom harness around, but its not surprising or unusual that it wo…

> You cannot use a ChatGPT subscription with a CLI tool

Okay, I'm done here. You obviously have no idea how this works (I have a ChatGPT subscription that I use with Codex).

I know you're new to HN, but when someone says: I've literally built subscription tools at both Microsoft and Apple for over 25 years, you might want to stop and reconsider if you might be missing something. You are.

/blocked

Re: Anthropic says OpenClaw-style Claude CLI usage is allowed again

#308

Post by cruffle_duffle »

jstummbillig wrote: post #249
joshstrange wrote: post #192

Well that's clear as mud. I've complained, extensively, about this before but Anthropic really needs to make it clear what is and is not supported with or without a subscription. Until then, it's hard to know where you stand with using their products. I say all of this as someone who doesn't use OpenClaw or any Claw-like product currently. I just want to know what I can and can't do and currently it's impossible to k…

I have no trouble believing that all labs are trying really hard to come up with an enticing bundle of something works for a wide variety of users, but it's hard to anticipate the popularity of something like OpenClaw, which completely blows through all previous usage patterns at population level. It seems like a tall order to set lasting rules in this space at this point, where nobody really understands what is goin…

I feel like this is basically the answer. Things are constantly changing and it’s hard to predict what things have staying power and what is just a blip on the evolutionary railroad.

All this fuzzyness from Anthropic reads more like an incredibly fast growing company working in a brand new space full of uncharted waters. In other words, they are making shit up not because they suck but because that is literally all one can do.

Re: Anthropic says OpenClaw-style Claude CLI usage is allowed again

#309

Post by aurareturn »

ex-aws-dude wrote: post #260
aurareturn wrote: post #126

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm aware. When I say "Hacker News", I mean a very sizable portion of users who keep repeating the OpenAI collapse imminent opinion.

https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/Goomba_fallacy

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Argument_from_fallacy
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