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GLM-5: Targeting complex systems engineering and long-horizon agentic tasks

z.ai

301–310 of 540 posts

Re: GLM-5: Targeting complex systems engineering and long-horizon agentic tasks

#301
post #227
post #215

Pelican generated via OpenRouter: https://gist.github.com/simonw/cc4ca7815ae82562e89a9fdd99f07... Solid bird, not a great bicycle frame.

Thank you for continuing to maintain the only benchmarking system that matters! Context for the unaware: https://simonwillison.net/tags/pelican-riding-a-bicycle/

It's interesting how some features, such as green grass, a blue sky, clouds, and the sun, are ubiquitous among all of these models' responses.

Re: GLM-5: Targeting complex systems engineering and long-horizon agentic tasks

#302

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> it's comparing to last generation models (Opus 4.5 and GPT-5.2). If it's anywhere close to those models, I couldn't possibly be happier. Going from GLM-4.7 to something comparable to 4.5 or 5.2 would be an absolutely crazy improvement.

> Going from GLM-4.7 to something comparable to 4.5 or 5.2 would be an absolutely crazy improvement. Before you get too excited, GLM-4.7 outperformed Opus 4.5 on some benchmarks too - https://www.cerebras.ai/blog/glm-4-7 See the LiveCodeBench comparison The benchmarks of the open weights models are always more impressive than the performance. Everyone is competing for attention and market share so the incentives to b…

Yeah, I'm sure closed source model vendors are doing everything within their power to dumb down benchmarks, so they can look like underdogs and play a pity game against open weight models.

Let's have a serious discussion. Just because Claude PR department coined the term benchmaxxing, we we should not be using it unless they shell out some serious monetes.

Re: GLM-5: Targeting complex systems engineering and long-horizon agentic tasks

#303
post #233

The benchmarks are impressive, but it's comparing to last generation models (Opus 4.5 and GPT-5.2). The competitor models are new, but they would have easily had enough time to re-run the benchmarks and update the press release by now. Although it doesn't really matter much. All of the open weights models lately come with impressive benchmarks but then don't perform as well as expected in actual use. There's clearly…

They are all just token generators without any intelligence. There is so little difference nowadays that I think in a blind test nobody will be able to differentiate the models - whether open source or closed source. Today's meme was this question: "The car wash is only 50 meters from my house. I want to get my car washed, should I drive there or walk?" Here is Claude's answer just right now: "Walk! At only 50 meters…

Claude 4.6 got it first try:

"You’ll want to drive — you need the car at the car wash for them to wash it!

Even though it’s just 50 meters, the car has to be there. Enjoy the fresh clean car on the short drive back! "

Re: GLM-5: Targeting complex systems engineering and long-horizon agentic tasks

#304
post #233

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They are all just token generators without any intelligence. There is so little difference nowadays that I think in a blind test nobody will be able to differentiate the models - whether open source or closed source. Today's meme was this question: "The car wash is only 50 meters from my house. I want to get my car washed, should I drive there or walk?" Here is Claude's answer just right now: "Walk! At only 50 meters…

I just ran this with Gemini 3 Pro, Opus 4.6, and Grok 4 (the models I personally find the smartest for my work). All three answered correctly.

They had plenty of time to update their system prompts so they don't be embarrassed.

I noticed whenever such meme comes out, if you check immediately you can reproduce it yourself, but after a free hours it's already updated.

Re: GLM-5: Targeting complex systems engineering and long-horizon agentic tasks

#305

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For inference, even with continuous batching, getting 100% MFUs is basically impossible to do in practice. Even the frontier labs struggle with this in highly efficient infiniband clusters. Its slightly better with training workloads just due to all the batching and parallel compute, but still mostly unattainable with consumer rigs (you spend a lot of time waiting for I/O). I also don't think the 100% util is necessa…

Isn't this just saying that your GPU use is bottlenecked by things such as VRAM bandwidth and RAM-VRAM transfers? That's normal and expected.

[deleted]

Re: GLM-5: Targeting complex systems engineering and long-horizon agentic tasks

#306
post #56
post #5

It's looking like we'll have Chinese OSS to thank for being able to host our own intelligence, free from the whims of proprietary megacorps. I know it doesn't make financial sense to self-host given how cheap OSS inference APIs are now, but it's comforting not being beholden to anyone or requiring a persistent internet connection for on-premise intelligence. Didn't expect to go back to macOS but they're basically the…

They haven't published the weights yet, don't celebrate too early.

Now they have!

Re: GLM-5: Targeting complex systems engineering and long-horizon agentic tasks

#307
post #277

What I haven't seen discussed anywhere so far is how big a lead Anthropic seems to have in intelligence per output token, e.g. if you look at [1]. We already know that intelligence scales with the log of tokens used for reasoning, but Anthropic seems to have much more powerful non-reasoning models than its competitors. I read somewhere that they have a policy of not advancing capabilities too much, so could it be tha…

Intelligence per token doesn't seem quite right to me. Intelligence per feels closer. Per dollar, or per second, or per watt.

It is possible to think of tokens as some proxy for thinking space. At least reasoning tokens work like this.

Dollar/watt are not public and time has confounders like hardware.

Re: GLM-5: Targeting complex systems engineering and long-horizon agentic tasks

#308

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For inference, even with continuous batching, getting 100% MFUs is basically impossible to do in practice. Even the frontier labs struggle with this in highly efficient infiniband clusters. Its slightly better with training workloads just due to all the batching and parallel compute, but still mostly unattainable with consumer rigs (you spend a lot of time waiting for I/O). I also don't think the 100% util is necessa…

Isn't this just saying that your GPU use is bottlenecked by things such as VRAM bandwidth and RAM-VRAM transfers? That's normal and expected.

No I'm saying there are quite a few more bottlenecks than that (I/O being a big one). Even in the more efficient training frameworks, there's per-op dispatch overhead in python itself. All the boxing/unboxing of python objects to C++ handles, dispatcher lookup + setup, all the autograd bookkeeping, etc.

All of the bottlenecks in sum is why you'd never get to 100% MFUs (but I was conceding you probably don't need to in order to get value)

Re: GLM-5: Targeting complex systems engineering and long-horizon agentic tasks

#309

It's live on openrouter now. In my personal benchmark it's bad. So far the benchmark has been a really good indicator of instruction following and agentic behaviour in general. To those who are curious, the benchmark is just the ability of model to follow a custom tool calling format. I ask it to using coding tasks using chat.md [1] + mcps. And so far it's just not able to follow it at all. [1] https://github.com/rus…

Be careful with openrouter. They routinely host quantized versions of models via their listed providers and the models just suck because of that. Use the original providers only.

I specifically do not use the CN/SG based original provider simply because I don't want my personal data traveling across the pacific. I try to only stay on US providers. Openrouter shows you what the quantization of each provider is, so you can choose a domestic one that's FP8 if you want

Re: GLM-5: Targeting complex systems engineering and long-horizon agentic tasks

#310
post #233

The benchmarks are impressive, but it's comparing to last generation models (Opus 4.5 and GPT-5.2). The competitor models are new, but they would have easily had enough time to re-run the benchmarks and update the press release by now. Although it doesn't really matter much. All of the open weights models lately come with impressive benchmarks but then don't perform as well as expected in actual use. There's clearly…

They are all just token generators without any intelligence. There is so little difference nowadays that I think in a blind test nobody will be able to differentiate the models - whether open source or closed source. Today's meme was this question: "The car wash is only 50 meters from my house. I want to get my car washed, should I drive there or walk?" Here is Claude's answer just right now: "Walk! At only 50 meters…

I tried this prompt with all the major AI models that I know and have installed, and only GLM from Z.ai and Gemini 3 Flash could answer it. Even in that case, Gemini 3 Flash gave a bit more nuanced answer, but every other model like Claude Opus 4.5, Chat GPT, Grok - everything failed.
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