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The U.S. Government Just Followed Through on Its Ban of DJI Drones

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Re: The U.S. Government Just Followed Through on Its Ban of DJI Drones

#301

Post by AndrewKemendo »

ivell wrote: post #235
AndrewKemendo wrote: post #229

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What do you mean by pretense? The word pretense to me means “we’re gonna actually try this and let’s see how it goes” The United States has literally never done that and we know that because internal documentations for pretty much anything always have some kind of American benefit Nexus it is not based on any type of foundational belief that transcends the concept of “we’re gonna do whatever the people who are the lo…

The definition of pretense is (from Google): an attempt to make something that is not the case appear true. E.g. "his anger is masked by a pretence that all is well"

Yes that checks out, perhaps I misread your initial comment to imply that was something beneficial

Re: The U.S. Government Just Followed Through on Its Ban of DJI Drones

#302

Post by fidotron »

robomartin wrote: post #294
fidotron wrote: post #260

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're missing the point: the line between hobbyist and prototype now doesn't exist - there is a continuum where devices are made in single digits, tens of units, and progressively scaled up. This isn't the 80s/90s where you make none or thousands. Even those Amazon made wall socket relay things are ESP based after all. In this universe the old way of doing things makes no sense. > Who's sneering? Your comment was, a…

> You're missing the point: the line between hobbyist and prototype now doesn't exist - there is a continuum where devices are made in single digits, tens of units, and progressively scaled up. This isn't the 80s/90s where you make none or thousands. Even those Amazon made wall socket relay things are ESP based after all. Yeah, no. Sorry, you don't know what you are talking about. I've gone from self-funded garage st…

> Yeah, no. Sorry, you don't know what you are talking about.

"OK". This is why your snark is so easily detectable, you're the one that doesn't see how things have moved on.

> Once again, sorry, you might want to stop, this statement shows just how little you know. There's nothing in hobby-world that even remotely compares to the requirements of commercial and industrial products.

> Simple example: Nobody producing hobby products worries about setting someone's house on fire or making a device that interferes with pacemakers.

Yeah, they do. What do you think the 3D printer community worries about? It's a rapidly moving heating element shooting hot plastic, an inherent health and fire hazard if it goes wrong. If the likes of Bambu got this wrong you would absolutely know about it.

If drone control software crashes what happens? It falls out of the sky on to people.

And here you are coping that 3D printers or drones are easy products to develop in consumer friendly form.

I've worked on tablets and cellphones prototypes (things shipping in tens of millions per model variant) we had burn people in testing because of bugs caused by the usual supposedly reputable manufacturers. You can tell by some of the devices that actually shipped that big corp enthusiasm for risk taking can easily exceed what smaller scale producers will accept, and that to the right people it presents no obstacle to certification.

The Chinese have overtaken the west at actually being good at consumer electronics development, and the denial about this from people is frightening.

Re: The U.S. Government Just Followed Through on Its Ban of DJI Drones

#303

Post by CrimsonCape »

quesera wrote: post #283
CrimsonCape wrote: post #147

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just looking at the injection molded shell of my Mavic Mini makes me cringe when thinking about the startup cost. It's the plastic shell; not the motors, nor the circuitry, nor the optical parts...and to think you could build that in the USA is laughable. DJI releases 2-3 models every 2-3 years... if you could even find a company in the USA machining the steel molds at that frequency (i don't think it exists) how are…

I'm confused. Machining molds is not a lost or obscure technology. A skilled machinist (and the US has many) used to be able do it in any moderately-equipped machine shop. Is there something new and magic about modern injection molding?

I'm confused too. The parts are high quality and scream "in-house" and surely not the product of contract engineers or contract machinist work. But I don't think DJI has machinists or factories in-house? I would assume they are just the product designers but I guess it's probably some kind of unique workflow due to Shenzen.

I just anecdotally see that in the USA, the required iterative design process is too cost-prohibitive for injection molding, and likely the same for every other trade. So multiply number of trades (designer, CAD drafter, machinist, electrical engineer, software engineer, injection molder, assembler, etc.) multiplied by the number of experimental iterative processes required to build an institutional knowledgebase... it's cost-prohibited.

Re: The U.S. Government Just Followed Through on Its Ban of DJI Drones

#304

Post by SanjayMehta »

ericmay wrote: post #88
watwut wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> as China helps Russia with its invasion of Ukraine America is helping Russia with its invasion of Ukraine.

No it's not. This is factually incorrect. Even as recently as this past week the United States Navy has tracked down and seized Russian "shadow fleet" tankers which are operating despite American and European sanctions, and did so with Russian naval vessels nearby and despite strong protests and anger from Moscow. Hopefully Europe can step up its game and do so too. But do you know who is helping Russia besides China…

It's called rational sovereign self interest.

Of course, when we do it we're aiding Russia Russia Russia but when you aid and abet terrorists in say Pakistan that's "exporting democracy."

Re: The U.S. Government Just Followed Through on Its Ban of DJI Drones

#305

Post by SanjayMehta »

mikkupikku wrote: post #219
joe_mamba wrote: post #166

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It was 30 years of rot, neglect, theft and corruption that did the majority of the damage to Russia's post-USSR military. The army they have today in Ukraine is only a fraction of what they were capable of in the 1980s.

Don't forget, they choked on Afghanistan too.

Wrong. They did a planned and phased withdrawal over a period of several months.

Unlike Biden's Saigon 2.0 shambolic exit.

Re: The U.S. Government Just Followed Through on Its Ban of DJI Drones

#306

Post by robomartin »

fidotron wrote: post #302
robomartin wrote: post #294

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> You're missing the point: the line between hobbyist and prototype now doesn't exist - there is a continuum where devices are made in single digits, tens of units, and progressively scaled up. This isn't the 80s/90s where you make none or thousands. Even those Amazon made wall socket relay things are ESP based after all. Yeah, no. Sorry, you don't know what you are talking about. I've gone from self-funded garage st…

> Yeah, no. Sorry, you don't know what you are talking about. "OK". This is why your snark is so easily detectable, you're the one that doesn't see how things have moved on. > Once again, sorry, you might want to stop, this statement shows just how little you know. There's nothing in hobby-world that even remotely compares to the requirements of commercial and industrial products. > Simple example: Nobody producing h…

> This is why your snark is so easily detectable

If I argue with my wife about medical matters (she is an MD) her response might look or sound snarky to some. In reality, she would be correct in telling me how and why I would be wrong.

You really need to stop, because you are digging a deeper hole with every word. You just said that 3D printers and drone are easy consumer products to develop. You truly do not understand what it takes to develop these products. The vast majority of them are still incredibly unsafe. There's a minority that have greatly enhanced safety. It should not be surprising that the safe systems (with a couple of exceptions) cost tens of thousands to hundreds of thousands of dollars and address commercial/industrial markets, not hobby. The amount of engineering and testing these systems require is nothing less than massive.

Context: I've been designing, building and flying all kinds of RC planes, gliders, helicopters and multicopters for four decades. I have been designing, building and using 3D printers for over two decades. Our latest 3D printer for internal use is equipped with Teknic Clearpath motors with fully machined structure and parts made on our Haas CNC Vertical Machining Centers.

Again, please, chill, nobody is insulting the hobby world (which you seem to be offended by). These are different worlds. That's how it has been from the start of time. And that's OK.

Here, I'll help you stop. Let's agree to disagree. You are absolutely right and I am wrong.

Live long and prosper.

Re: The U.S. Government Just Followed Through on Its Ban of DJI Drones

#307

Post by defrost »

SanjayMehta wrote: post #305
mikkupikku wrote: post #219

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Don't forget, they choked on Afghanistan too.

Wrong. They did a planned and phased withdrawal over a period of several months. Unlike Biden's Saigon 2.0 shambolic exit.

That was indeed a US shitshow,

begun in the prior US administration: https://www.factcheck.org/2021/08/timeline-of-u-s-withdrawal...

Biden followed through on a poisoned chalice.

Re: The U.S. Government Just Followed Through on Its Ban of DJI Drones

#308

Post by SanjayMehta »

watwut wrote: post #289
alex43578 wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

By only giving Ukraine $175,000,000,000, instead of $500B? Or $1T and American boots on the ground? When has American done enough to fight Ukraine’s war for them?

In the past, Biden administration gave help to Ukraine. Trump stopped it entirely. Second, Trump is very much helping Russia, literally taking Russian positions in negotiations and pressuring only on Ukraine - into bad deals. Trump also talks admirably about Putin. So no, America switched sides.

Trump keeps reminding everyone that he supplied The Ukraine with Javelins.

Also, a series of NATO exercises which involved Ukrainian troops were conducted during the Trump 1.0 regime.

Operation Rapid Trident. (Trident seems to be a reference to a Ukrainian symbol.)

Now imagine China or Russia conducting such a series of exercises in Mexico.

Re: The U.S. Government Just Followed Through on Its Ban of DJI Drones

#309

Post by FpUser »

ericmay wrote: post #300
FpUser wrote: post #267

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>"Will Germans accept being drafted to go fight in Ukraine" Ukraine is not in EU. As for the rest - if they don't then, well, they were just hiding behind the US with all the consequences.

I’m not following your point, or maybe you missed mine. You said 100,000 Russian soldiers dead doesn’t make the US any safer, and I agree, but it does make Europe safer because there are fewer Russian soldiers. But then you compared the population of Russia and the EU to imply that Russia is no threat to Europe. But that analysis is flawed, because the population of Europe isn’t one monolithic block that is guarantee…

>You said 100,000 Russian ..."

I think you putting words in my mouth. Quote me please. This was somebody else's statement

>"But that analysis is flawed, because the population of Europe isn’t one monolithic block that is guaranteed to respond to Russia"

And my answer was that if they do not they were just hiding behind the US all that time. If the EU will not fight for the EU then, well no need for me to continue..

>"And your reply was Ukraine is not in the EU"

This was in response to: "Will Germans accept being drafted to go fight in Ukraine". They (Germans) will most likely not accept and exactly for the reason that the Ukraine is not in the EU.

Re: The U.S. Government Just Followed Through on Its Ban of DJI Drones

#310

Post by SanjayMehta »

ivell wrote: post #109
Kapura wrote: post #2

Seeing how drone warfare has become the new hot front in 21st century conflicts like Ukraine, it's hard not to speculate on the implications of this as political unrest continues to rise in the U.S. It's no secret that the current U.S. regime views a sizeable portion of its own civilian citizens as enemy combatants. They are already shooting people in the face and not even putting up a pretense of acting shocked at t…

My takeaway is that all previous U.S. administrations had pretense of morality and rules in both international and domestic politics (even when they did dubious stuff). The new administration has realized that there is no need for such pretense to stay in power. Previously Venezuelan attack would have been about "democracy" and "freedom" and "peace". Trump has made it clear that it is for oil. Overall it is probably…

The US invaded Iraq because Saddam was planning to switch to the Euro for his oil trade. They invaded Libya as Gaddafi was working on a gold backed African dinar/Lira, again for the oil trade.

The only reason why the dollar has had any value since 1971 is due to Nixon's brilliant creation of the petro-dollar.

It's allowed them to export inflation to the rest of the world.

Trump gets it, and the only reason for kidnapping Maduro is again oil.

If a country has oil, and no nukes, in due course the US will invade.

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