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Kroger acknowledges that its bet on robotics went too far

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Re: Kroger acknowledges that its bet on robotics went too far

#301

Post by karamanolev »

mikaoj85 wrote: post #191
karamanolev wrote: post #123

I work in this exact space (online grocery retailer in Europe). We're profitable and one of the few companies to be so in the sector - many online divisions are losing money and being bankrolled by the parent company with physical stores. Alternatively, burning VC money. The thing that's wrong with Ocado's technology is that it's ridiculously expensive and tailored for huge FC's (fulfillment centers). The problem wit…

> Ocado solves for scaling up, what needs to be solved is actually scaling down. This has been solved by Pio (by AutoStore)

Autostore is great, but it's a small component for a business to be profitable end-to-end. Maybe 20% of the whole thing.

Re: Kroger acknowledges that its bet on robotics went too far

#302

Post by karamanolev »

Onavo wrote: post #209
karamanolev wrote: post #123

I work in this exact space (online grocery retailer in Europe). We're profitable and one of the few companies to be so in the sector - many online divisions are losing money and being bankrolled by the parent company with physical stores. Alternatively, burning VC money. The thing that's wrong with Ocado's technology is that it's ridiculously expensive and tailored for huge FC's (fulfillment centers). The problem wit…

So who's their target customer? Are we talking about Amazon/Temu scale here?

Seems so, but the economics for groceries don't work like that since you don't ship a slice of meat and a bottle of milk like you ship a 512GB SD card or a smartphone.

Re: Kroger acknowledges that its bet on robotics went too far

#303

Post by reaperducer »

lotsofpulp wrote: post #85
michaelt wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It depends on your business model. If a basket of groceries brought online costs $15 more than the in-store prices, then you can pick in-store profitably, very easy. That's the instacart model. But if a basket of groceries brought online costs about the same as buying in-store? With the retailer bearing the costs of picking, packing and delivery instead of the customer? Well then you need something more efficient tha…

And how about charging more in store than online? On two separate occasions, I stopped by Walmart recently and spent $0.50 extra and $1.50 extra by walking in, going to the aisle, and picking up the item myself. The Walmart app even tells you that the price on the app is only for online orders. But I didn’t want to wait for an unknown amount of time for a Walmart employee to bring it out to my car (been more than 10…

And how about charging more in store than online?

I find your Wal-Mart anecdote interesting, because the chain supermarket that I use is the exact opposite.

I buy the same items from the same store every two weeks (then supplement at neighborhood stores). Sometimes I shop in-store, and sometimes I get delivery. But the two-week shopping list is so unchanging that I even use the shopping list on the delivery web site when I'm walking through the aisles.

Because of this, I notice that the supermarket charges more for products being delivered than those retrieved in-store. Sometimes it's enough that I'll text my wife a picture of the price tag in the store, followed by a screenshot from the store's delivery web site.

Recently from memory, a 12-pack of ginger ale was about $3 more for delivery than in the store. But I'd say overall, probably 80% of the items I buy regularly are cheaper in the store.

These days, I only get things delivered if I have other significant obligations that warrant paying a 10% delivery markup, plus the delivery fee, plus a tip.

I think the price discrepancy between in-store and delivery is the reason that so many supermarkets I've been to recently (and also Macy's) have zero cell phone service under their roofs.

Re: Kroger acknowledges that its bet on robotics went too far

#304

Post by 0xffff2 »

gilbetron wrote: post #35
liquidise wrote: post #5

Good news for blue collar workers, tough for investors. The bean-counting dream of LLM's and Robotics remains, but until ChatGPT is placing your order at Mcdonalds drive-thrus and Amazon is laying off warehouse associates en masse, i'd say that last 5% is still taking 95% of the time.

Taco Bell by us has AI order taking and it is amazing. Quick, always has been getting it correct, and easy to understand. Granted, it's probably very abusable, but for someone just wanting to put in a quick order it is way better than a person.

I've had very bad luck with Taco Bell's AI. It is not good at all with modifications in my experience. I actually order on the app now just to minimize my interaction with the chatbot. It is very good at processing "mobile order for " at least.

Re: Kroger acknowledges that its bet on robotics went too far

#305

Post by drew870mitchell »

roryirvine wrote: post #148
simgt wrote: post #136

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Where are you operating? I live in a dense European city and I don't know a single person who orders groceries online. Smallish shops with bike racks in front of the door are simply too convenient, seems hard to beat. Next few days shopping can easily be done in 15mn on the way back home.

I live in inner London. I have multiple grocery shops around me - within 10 minutes' walk I have a fishmonger, two butchers, two delicatessens, three bakeries, three greengrocers, four mid-sized organic/international grocers, six patisseries, a large Lidl, and a very large Sainsbury's supermarket. I visit those local shops once or twice almost every day to pick up fresh bits and pieces - but I still get bulky or heav…

Balancing out the other comment - there's two real supermarkets within a fifteen minute walk of me (another American). It's fun to leave meal planning up to whatever is on sale that night.

For people in the outer suburbs where that's not an option, I don't know why a service hasn't arisen where you can plug in, "we have X adults living here, they average Y meals per week made at home, we want Z grams of protein per meal, here's our dietary restrictions, solve that system of equations out of whatever's in your warehouse and take a flat rate for delivery and percentage for your overhead." The pure delivery services all seem to be plays to hide huge prices behind tricky introductory rates. Both my local supermarkets offer delivery and presumably have the data to make that possible but they want me to still pick individual items in a vastly worse interface (any website or app) than the experience of standing in a dry goods aisle.

Re: Kroger acknowledges that its bet on robotics went too far

#306

Post by wayeq »

> Kroger said on Tuesday that its decision to close the three robotic facilities, along with other adjustments to its e-commerce operations, would provide a $400 million boost as it looks to improve e-commerce profitability.

Amazing that both opening and subsequently closing the facilities could provide a boost to profitability.

Re: Kroger acknowledges that its bet on robotics went too far

#307

Post by [deleted] »

AngryData wrote: post #89
alphabettsy wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Then put the warehouse on the first floor and put the store on top. Lots of big cities have grocery stores with parking garages under them, doesn’t seem much different.

The difference is the 100x the cost to build it and the completely different amounts of foot traffic and margins available in dense city centers. Nobody is going to build such a store if their return on investment is expected 50-100 years down the road.

[deleted]

Re: Kroger acknowledges that its bet on robotics went too far

#308

Post by dredmorbius »

l72 wrote: post #273
mapt wrote: post #182

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And what some of us might not have the context for, is that grocery stores at the time were usually clerk-serviced; Just like you don't pump your own gas in New Jersey, at the time the norm was that you handed the clerk a list of products and they fetched them from the shelves for you. Arguably this model has a great deal of compatibility with robotic compact storage, especially in high-land-value areas.

And surprisingly, it was actually Piggly Wiggly that was the first grocery store to open up their warehouse and allow customers to self-service! [1] > Piggly Wiggly was the first self-service grocery store. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Piggly_Wiggly#History

And both PW and Keedoozle were launched by Clarence Saunders (touched on in the history link you give, more under his bio page):

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clarence_Saunders>

Re: Kroger acknowledges that its bet on robotics went too far

#309

Post by Dylan16807 »

rolandog wrote: post #197
Dylan16807 wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wasn't saying you implied anything. I was saying rolandog seemed to go beyond general cynicism about corporations to an unreasonable complaint. Looking at the details, I could say Kroger shouldn't have hired her but I'd rather say that if she was dangerous enough to not hire as a driver then her license shouldn't have been reinstated in the first place. (Though that's if "couldn’t recall if her driver’s license was…

Thanks for correcting me, I would've sworn this was about a truck with autopilot. So, if I'm understanding it correctly: although the driver was at fault, there were systematic failures in training personnel that would've prevented an unqualified driver from driving the truck?

Yeah, that seems about right. It's a failure but it's not tied closely to regulation and it's not something that should affect their overall plans.

Re: Kroger acknowledges that its bet on robotics went too far

#310

Post by tomcam »

roryirvine wrote: post #251
lazide wrote: post #236

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you are getting those things anyway, and only need small portions of the other, then why bother?

Because otherwise you'd have to do a lot more planning in advance. For instance, I called in to the patisserie this morning on a whim to treat myself to a pain au chocolat for breakfast. And I think I fancy cheese for dinner, so after work I'll nip out to the deli for some stilton and the greengrocer for walnuts and figs to go with it. I've already got fancy crackers and some good port from my last online delivery so…

I need to say you are totally living the life. Good on you.
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