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Israeli-founded app preloaded on Samsung phones is attracting controversy

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Re: Israeli-founded app preloaded on Samsung phones is attracting controversy

#301

Post by yupyupyups »

cyanydeez wrote: post #182
rootusrootus wrote: post #165

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I remember back when the iPhone came out, this was perhaps the most noteworthy aspect of it, at least to me. We were so used to phones coming with crap on them and tightly coupled to the carrier. If the carrier didn't want something on the phone, it never got there. So Apple comes along and says "Hey, AT&T, we will make you the exclusive carrier for the iPhone iff you leave the entire experience under our control." T…

"I was so happy to get locked into a different eco system" is all I hear.

When you think of old phones, think of the touch interface on a printer.

I don't like Apple either, they are DEFINITELY rent seeking and violating their users' privacy at the same time. There is no excuse for that. I think what the parent post was talking about is something historical. An iPhone at that time was a large step above a Nokia or a Sony Ericsson in terms of flexibility.

Re: Israeli-founded app preloaded on Samsung phones is attracting controversy

#302

Post by baked_beanz »

sophrosyne42 wrote: post #272
baked_beanz wrote: post #201

Earlier quoted context omitted.

...and destroying or damaging >2/3rds of all structures in Gaza and killing tens of thousands of civilians with airstrikes isn't? Obviously yes, Hamas and Hezbollah indiscriminately firing rockets at Israel consistute war crimes. I assume you must agree that Israel's systematic targeting of schools, hospitals, mosques, and refugee camps would also qualify?

Destroying buildings due to being booby trapped by Hamas; booby trapping I seem to recall was mentioned earlier in this thread as a war crime.

You're claiming that every building destroyed by an Israeli airstrike was booby trapped by Hamas...?

Even if that were the case, destroying those buildings with civilians inside is still a war crime

Re: Israeli-founded app preloaded on Samsung phones is attracting controversy

#303

Post by lemontheme »

amarcheschi wrote: post #205
baklavaEmperor wrote: post #126

What’s striking is how often these ‘small’ surveillance tech stories trace back to the same state-aligned ecosystem. When Israel does it, it’s treated as a complex security issue. When another ‘bad’ country does the same thing, we immediately call it espionage. And almost on cue, the discussion drifts anywhere except the uncomfortable fact that it’s the same ecosystem from the same country showing up again.

I mean, it's literally the same thing that happens when past genocides are bad, but when they happen today from an ally of the west... "it's complicated". Except this time happens on the technological side rather than the humanitarian one

Well, that same ally has also been doing a bit of genocide on the humanitarian side lately, just so we’re clear on the facts

Re: Israeli-founded app preloaded on Samsung phones is attracting controversy

#305

Post by dijit »

tovej wrote: post #268
dijit wrote: post #261

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I appreciate you sharing these links and pushing back. It’s clear you’re coming from a place of deep conviction about the historical injustices here, and I respect that. The Nakba is undeniably a catastrophe for Palestinians, involving mass expulsions, village destructions, and profound human suffering that shapes their identity to this day. Plan Dalet, as outlined in the Wikipedia article you linked, was indeed a Ha…

Thank you also for engaging in a civil manner. I still don't understand how you can view the Israeli foundation myth, and the "fear of an existential threat" as legitimate, when the Israeli state's founding was an unjust, immoral, wrong undertaking, the foundation of a colony on someone's homeland. If a perpetrator breaks into a house and kicks out the homeowners, then declares the attempts to take back said house as…

I try my best when trying to understand things, to think about how people have it today, and not to tie everything to what peoples ancestors did.

The only thing people can really do today is to acknowledge the past, and to do something about it, and if we’re taking the Israeli perspective now, then what we’re essentially telling them to do is not exist.

Many are fine with that being the case (why should they exist when its founded on evil) but there’s a few points there that make it harder to swallow I think.

1) I think if someone told me that I had no right to live in my home country because of its past I would get quite bent out of shape, especially if blood was shed.

(again, not arguing that this makes it entirely valid, just arguing a perspective).

2) It sort of justifies actual genocide. As mentioned in my other examples; any invading force in future will probably slaughter everyone. Because the international conversation surrounding genocides of the last 30 years is a lot more tame than how we talk about the suffering of palestinians.

This disproportionate discussion probably feels unfair, since the average Israeli probably feels like they would want to live peacefully today, if only they were not constantly attacked by Iranian proxies every time attempts at normalisation looked like they were succeeding. Unfortunately this would then include terrorism from Palestine.

I have to really caveat again, that I don’t think Israel is peachy, just that today the Palestinian narrative is a bit more empathised with internationally- but I wouldn’t like myself being in either countries shoes honestly.

Re: Israeli-founded app preloaded on Samsung phones is attracting controversy

#306

Post by t0bia_s »

summermusic wrote: post #105
duxup wrote: post #2

I recently bought a cheap android device because I needed to test something on Android. The setup was about 3 hours of the device starting up, asking me questions, installing apps I explicitly told it not to, and then all sorts of other apps and OS updates trying to do their thing seemingly at once. I wasn't even transferring data, just a brand new phone, new google account. What a horrible experience you get with so…

This is why custom ROM support is the first question I ask when buying a new Android phone

Rather refurbished, because those are longer on market thus development of custom ROM (like LineageOS) is more likely. And of course you save a lot of money.

Re: Israeli-founded app preloaded on Samsung phones is attracting controversy

#307

Post by t0bia_s »

robgibbons wrote: post #186
consumer451 wrote: post #167

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I haven't bought an android device for a few years, but the last time I did, it was also a very cheap one for testing. I chose an "Android One" to avoid all these issues. Is something like that still an option?

Your best bet might be one of the Pixel "a" series, which are Google's budget-oriented models. Stock vanilla Android with as little bloat as you can hope for.

Those Pixels have options to open bootloader and after flashing custom ROM that is much cleaner (GrapheneOS) to lock it again. Which is currently most secure way to have clean and secure android device.

Re: Israeli-founded app preloaded on Samsung phones is attracting controversy

#309

Post by amarcheschi »

lemontheme wrote: post #303
amarcheschi wrote: post #205

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I mean, it's literally the same thing that happens when past genocides are bad, but when they happen today from an ally of the west... "it's complicated". Except this time happens on the technological side rather than the humanitarian one

Well, that same ally has also been doing a bit of genocide on the humanitarian side lately, just so we’re clear on the facts

Oh yes

Re: Israeli-founded app preloaded on Samsung phones is attracting controversy

#310

Post by pbiggar »

ashdksnndck wrote: post #65
pbiggar wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In fact Elasticsearch was specifically mentioned as a partner of the "Gaza Humanitarian Foundation", a fake aid org who caused many Palestinians to be killed under their watch. (Elasticsearch denied involvement when I contacted them) But to be more specific I would narrow it down to avoiding using any tech which Israel could use for surveillance, narrative control, or harm.

Opposing a specific organization for engaging in specific acts is a lot less objectionable than discriminating based on national origin.

We're not basing on national origin, we're basing on specific participation in occupation, which is being done by the Israeli state and army.
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