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maurycyz.com

301–310 of 388 posts

Re: No adblocker detected

#301
post #122

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We had static ads. We called them banners and websites abused them. Some sites were so bad that it was challenging to find content between horizontal and vertical banners. Animated GIFs followed soon and then everything else we know. Some sites are still as bad as those old ones. I'm can't believe what eyes are seeing any time I look at friends browsing on their computers.

Good point. My point still stands that it's possible to have ad revenue with unintrusive ads. For instance, I'm fine with video creators having sponsored sequences because I can skip them if I want. And there's no way for them to know if I watched the ad. In fact, they don't care because they already got paid.

Unintrusive ads are still there to manipulate you into acting against your own interests and therefore unethical.

> I'm fine with video creators having sponsored sequences because I can skip them if I want.

I'm not fine with them because skipping the obvious segments doesn't mean the rest of the content isn't compromised due to the financial incentive to not upset those advertisers.

Re: No adblocker detected

#302
post #144

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sites are using ads to be anti-competitive, such that you literally cannot compete with them on price because their price is $0. I'm rather surprised that we haven't seen the emergence of a site where you are literally paid to use it, because that business model is 100% viable. And the reason that business model is viable is because people don't realize how literally valuable their attention is. And most people also…

SomethingAwful forums have this for ages but also newspapers do, too. As do streaming services. Turns out youth don't have much to spend (nor to people generally outside of West), and it stops sockpuppets somewhat.

Those are websites you have to pay, not websites that pay you to use them.

Re: No adblocker detected

#303
post #171

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> There is an unwritten social contract here. Yes, there is. It's, "I ask your server for bytes, and if your server gives them to me, I interpret and display them however I wish". The idea that someone downloading a webpage from a publicly-hosted web server could be a "freeloader" is ludicrous. If you really must extract some form of payment from literally everyone who visits your site, you'll have to put up a paywal…

Yes, the paywall is reasonable, I agree. I think what the OP meant by 'social contract' is that if everybody were to use an adblocker, we would end up with a mostly paywalled internet. All the sites that currently have ads, would have a paywall. The reason why some people get to browse the internet free, and without ads, is because there are some people that don't. Hence the 'leeching' part. The part that annoys me s…

We didn't have a paywalled internet before ads became commonplace. Most content on the internet is still user-generated and almost all of those users do not get paid anything from the ads put on their works. Hosting is quite cheap unless you want to run a centralized service that serves literally everyone.

If anything is a social contract then it's that if you want to provide a paid service you are up front about requiring payment. Ad-supported websites don't much care about that social contract because they think it's more profitable to pretend to be free when they are not.

Re: No adblocker detected

#304
post #209

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have DNS based adblocking on home router, plus adblock extension. Every time I use the web using 5G data or public wifi, I regret the experience. Then I immediately turn on an adblocking VPN.

Firefox Mobile + uBlock solves this.

Firefox + Tailscale + setting the DNS server to your AdGuard/PiHole is actually the better solution overall.

I use AdNauseum instead of plain uBlock as just an added layer of protection but it's rarely needed.

Re: No adblocker detected

#305
post #174

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A consensus answer to "what should google.com look like?" does not suggest or imply any sort of "social contract". There is not, and has never been, a social contract that says I have to look at the ads served with any website. If you think there is, then I'm sorry, but you're sorely mistaken. Similarly, there is no social contract that says I have to watch commercials while I'm watching TV (not that I've watched lin…

>does not suggest or imply any sort of "social contract" We were talking about societal expectations. >I can mute it, change the channel, go to the bathroom, whatever. You are free to do the same for websites. You can click the x button on the ad, mute the video ad, or change to a different website.

We are also free to install adblockers.

Re: No adblocker detected

#306
post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My view is that core bargain was fine, but advertisers have broken the agreement with other offenses, like: * Autoplay videos that preemptively take my bandwidth. * Autoplay audio that takes over my speakers unexpectedly and interrupts other things. * Forms of pop-ups that clutter or disrupt my tab/window control. * Being spied-on by a system that tries to aggregate and track all of my browsing habits. * A mostly una…

I wish there was a middle ground where I could block ads like the ones you mention, while allowing privacy-respecting ads that don't ruin my browsing experience. I know Adblock Plus have their "Acceptable Ads" policy [1], but that just meant letting through ads from companies that paid them, like Google [2]. [1] https://adblockplus.org/acceptable-ads [2] https://www.theverge.com/2013/7/5/4496852/adblock-plus-eye-g...

Ads are only easy to block because they load from centralized, third-party domains. Physical print publishers don't leave blanks in their newspapers and send them off to advertisers to fill in. They approve and print the ads, just like any other content. If digital publishers made similar agreements to embed static ads, they would not be affected by ad blockers.

Re: No adblocker detected

#307

I'm torn. I'm not a huge fan of ads and I don't have a lot of respect for the modern ad networks. However this culture of expecting websites to host the data then freeloading off it by blocking the tracking and ads is also a bit ugly. There is an unwritten social contract here. Websites are willing to host and organise a vast number of content because that'll attract an audience for ads. If there are too may freeload…

I've come to feel that the unwritten social contract was broken decades ago when ad networks decided their best bet was to become data farms and to sell ads and private data to any bidder regardless of ethics (and morality and truth in advertising laws).

My only "ad blocker" is Firefox enhanced tracking protection and walling off Facebook (Meta, but their only app I still use is Facebook), Amazon, and Google logins to separate containers and/or apps and/or private browsing tools. I feel like this is a good ethical compromise still fills my part of the social contract. If a site wants to show me the most generic, untargeted ads, I welcome that.

They don't get my data for free, that's not part of an ethical relationship with ad networks in my mind. I am happiest to keep them in the dark and feed them junk and lies, that is all I think that they deserve.

It's fascinating how the ad networks respond to this. Several, like Admiral (to especially call out at least one offender) whine loudly that I'm using an ad blocker because they've confused targeting and tracker blocking with ad blocking and ask me to disable it. They don't even try to show ads. It seems pretty clear what their real slimy game is and I don't think they deserve to exist. Ads existed for centuries without tracking and privacy violations. Ad "common sense" up until about the 1980s was the broader the message and distribution the better; demographics and targeting was about saving money with the trade off of losing potential audiences. The more you target an ad the less you benefit from people that didn't even know your product might apply to them, or to people that might buy it for others or as gifts. "Everyone knew that."

Google is nasty in its own ways. ReCaptchas get worse. YouTube ads have several levels of hell, including interruptions in parts of videos it shouldn't interrupt, all sorts of racist and intellectually disgusting groups (including but not limited to allowing outright scams, platforming disinformation, and spreading malware) it allows to buy ads, and how much it allows those groups to serve 30 minute/1 hour/2+ hour videos as "ads". It's amazing how many ads I've felt I had to report from hate groups alone. All of that seems to background radiation for everyone with access to Google's ad networks, but the less tracking data you have the fewer targeted ads you see and the more the mask off greed feeds you terrifying things that make you wonder how humanity is okay with all this and why Google isn't seen as more of a greedy, evil company for how much of this stuff they fail to vet and continue to associate their brand with.

Show me old family friendly TV advertising staples like Clorox ads and whatever the latest cereal fad is, please, I don't mind. That's a written social contract that worked for a long time, especially because it had rules like Truth in Advertising laws and followed ethics boundaries like brand contamination by association with criminals and liars. Targeted advertising is and was a mistake. Ad networks believing private data was their new playground and revenue gold mine was a mistake. Neither of those, I think fit the old social contracts about ad-subsidized content, and I think all we can do is send a message that both of them break the spirit of the contract and it is past time for a change/fix.

But that's also maybe just me and a personal crusade at this point. I don't see a lot of people going to the sort of privacy minded extremes I have and also still not install an actual ad blocker. But that's how I'm trying to square the ethics dilemma of appreciating ad-subsidized content, but also understanding that the internet is no longer safe without some sort of privacy-minded safeguards that companies like Admiral and Google are going around and calling "ad blocking", because it is starting to interfere with their real, more lucrative, and much more evil business models.

Re: No adblocker detected

#308

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wonder what happens if you take a sharp object such a screwdriver and poke all the speakers…

While being recorded from 6 different angles while standing next to your vehicle with a license plate on it? You get arrested. That’s what happens. Kiosk makers have already thought of all of these possibilities. There isn’t a nicely exposed speaker. It’s behind a metal plate with tiny holes in it.

> You get arrested. That’s what happens.

For petty vandalism? That seems like an expensive overreaction.

Perhaps it depends on your demography.

Re: No adblocker detected

#309
post #279

I'm torn. I'm not a huge fan of ads and I don't have a lot of respect for the modern ad networks. However this culture of expecting websites to host the data then freeloading off it by blocking the tracking and ads is also a bit ugly. There is an unwritten social contract here. Websites are willing to host and organise a vast number of content because that'll attract an audience for ads. If there are too may freeload…

> However this culture of expecting websites to host the data then freeloading off it by blocking the tracking and ads is also a bit ugly. No it isn't. Free websites exist: Wordpress, Blogger, Wix, Weebly etc. The only "ad" they show is a static banner for their own platform, not the giant scripts Google loads for Google Ads. Neocities and Digital Ocean are $5/mo for a custom domain and hosting, theme it anyway you l…

Just a shame that Wordpress has been weaponised to create the crappy seo content affiliate spam sites that are making the web so shitty these days

Re: No adblocker detected

#310
post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My view is that core bargain was fine, but advertisers have broken the agreement with other offenses, like: * Autoplay videos that preemptively take my bandwidth. * Autoplay audio that takes over my speakers unexpectedly and interrupts other things. * Forms of pop-ups that clutter or disrupt my tab/window control. * Being spied-on by a system that tries to aggregate and track all of my browsing habits. * A mostly una…

I wish there was a middle ground where I could block ads like the ones you mention, while allowing privacy-respecting ads that don't ruin my browsing experience. I know Adblock Plus have their "Acceptable Ads" policy [1], but that just meant letting through ads from companies that paid them, like Google [2]. [1] https://adblockplus.org/acceptable-ads [2] https://www.theverge.com/2013/7/5/4496852/adblock-plus-eye-g...

My approach today is Firefox with Enhanced Tracking Protection and then keeping Google, Meta/Facebook, and Amazon logins sequestered to individual containers. At that point a lot of the worst ad networks will complain that you are using "an ad blocker" simply because most of their trackers fail and won't even bother showing ads.

(Then on mobile, similarly using Firefox on iOS, being heavy and fast on the "ask app not to track" buttons and keeping logins to first party apps only and almost never in either Safari or Firefox.)

Again, I use no real "ad blocker", just the above steps.

It's probably not an approach for everyone, and entails a bit of paranoia to operate, but I think it sends the right message that I don't mind untracked/untargeted ads and don't think companies deserve my unfiltered data.

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