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Microsoft will switch off Recall by default after security backlash

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Re: Microsoft will switch off Recall by default after security backlash

#301

Post by pocketarc »

gleenn wrote: post #285
jandrese wrote: post #272

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Dear OS writers: Internet access is not always guaranteed or reliable. Please do not assume that the cloud is a viable solution for every user. I ran into this on my phone awhile back. I knew I would be out of service for some time but had some PDFs I needed to reference. So I downloaded them to "files". Que surprise when I later go to look up a value and there's a little cloud with a down arrow button next to the PD…

This is the number one thing that annoys me about so many apps, especially apps with clear use-cases for offline use like listening to music, reading, and learning apps. I don't understand how so many app writers have never gone for a run through a canyon or flown on an airplane. I specifically pay money to SoundCloud for instance just for the "feature" to cache the music locally and somehow it regularly gets stuck c…

> I don't understand how so many app writers have never gone for a run through a canyon or flown on an airplane.

In the UK, every time I got on a train, I'd experience that. And it was worse than not having internet; you had internet, but with extreme packet loss and instability, meaning that every app out there would simply stall, even if it already had the data to do whatever it is I wanted it to do, because it was waiting on some background request to complete. And because I had internet, the request didn't just fail, but it also wouldn't complete in any reasonable amount of time.

Very frustrating.

Re: Microsoft will switch off Recall by default after security backlash

#302

Post by wannacboatmovie »

atribecalledqst wrote: post #260

Maybe a bit off-topic, but I sure wish they'd do this for OneDrive! I installed Windows for personal use for the first time recently (although I use it exclusively at work) and it drove me ABSOLUTELY BONKERS that my home drive was mapping to C:\Users\atribecalledqst\OneDrive. What I hated the most was that the File Explorer just calls the folders in there e.g. "Documents" and "Pictures" without showing the full path.…

The proper way of doing it is to use the API calls that have existed for decades to get the paths of well-known folders. It is because they are known to move and in fact having a roaming profile on a server location dates to the mid 90s with WinNT.

If you're hard coding paths you're doing it wrong.

Re: Microsoft will switch off Recall by default after security backlash

#303

Post by kenny11 »

usrbinbash wrote: post #257
herf wrote: post #58

It's interesting to compare this to the Chrome/Safari/Edge browsing history, which is stored in an unencrypted SQLite database, and tracks what you do for the last 90 days. It's just a bit less visual, Incognito/Private modes work, and some users clear it more often. But a whole lot of the surveillance attacks people imagine about Recall apply just the same to the browser. I think it's the "little brother" casual att…

1. Browsing history doesn't show what the user is doing on the page. There is a big difference between logging "user visited his e-banking app", and logging his actual credentials as they are entered. 2. Browsing history watches one app. Screenshots watch everything across the entire OS.

Not just credentials - account balances, account numbers, etc. There's a big difference between your browser history recording that you opened your bank or healthcare provider's web site and Recall recording everything that appeared on the screen while you did.

People might use Incognito mode to browse porn, but I imagine it's a lot less common when looking at other sensitive sites.

Re: Microsoft will switch off Recall by default after security backlash

#304

Post by modeless »

A4ET8a8uTh0 wrote: post #92
modeless wrote: post #73

It is puzzling to me that so many people seem to think this concept has no value. To me the concept is obviously good and something I have wanted for a long time. Of course the security of the implementation is important and I agree with some of the criticism there. But I see a lot of people arguing that the feature is worthless, or that it doesn't make sense at the OS level, or that Microsoft specifically should not…

Hmm. I think I can respond here. No one is really saying this feature has no value. For a user, there is value to being able to get to a previous point in time. That feature, however, is clearly not very well designed and implemented if it took days for it to be cracked on the internet for everyone to see. If I could trust that it STAYS local, maybe I would be less paranoid. But this is MS we are talking about. Perso…

> No one is really saying this feature has no value

Oh yeah?

> I have a really hard time understanding the use case for something like this. Stuff that I want to remember I just write down https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40612277

> the only people that really want this feature are the ones trying to push it down everyones collective throat. Why is MS pushing something so hard when nobody asked for it? https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40611263

> It really doesn't [sound like a cool feature]. Not a single person I've spoken to likes the idea of this, at all https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40445335

> i have never wanted to go back in history [...] what’s the use case https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40544521

etc.

Re: Microsoft will switch off Recall by default after security backlash

#305

Post by tkuraku »

atribecalledqst wrote: post #260

Maybe a bit off-topic, but I sure wish they'd do this for OneDrive! I installed Windows for personal use for the first time recently (although I use it exclusively at work) and it drove me ABSOLUTELY BONKERS that my home drive was mapping to C:\Users\atribecalledqst\OneDrive. What I hated the most was that the File Explorer just calls the folders in there e.g. "Documents" and "Pictures" without showing the full path.…

It is infuriating when I open the file explorer and it takes many seconds to populate the side bar. This wasn't the case wit windows 10. Everyting in one drive really makes things take a long time. OneDrive is great, but I want a OneDrive folder where things are sync'd, not transparently transforming the file system into OneDrive.

Re: Microsoft will switch off Recall by default after security backlash

#306

Post by modeless »

cesarb wrote: post #222
modeless wrote: post #73

It is puzzling to me that so many people seem to think this concept has no value. To me the concept is obviously good and something I have wanted for a long time. Of course the security of the implementation is important and I agree with some of the criticism there. But I see a lot of people arguing that the feature is worthless, or that it doesn't make sense at the OS level, or that Microsoft specifically should not…

> It is puzzling to me that so many people seem to think this concept has no value. To me the concept is obviously good and something I have wanted for a long time. The issue is not that the concept has no value. The issue is that the risks and drawbacks are so severe, that they override any value the concept would have. It's like asbestos, or leaded fuel; these have several useful properties, but their drawbacks are…

That's your opinion, but you can't deny there are a lot of people arguing that the concept essentially has no value. Even on this very page.

> I have a really hard time understanding the use case for something like this. Stuff that I want to remember I just write down https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40612277

> the only people that really want this feature are the ones trying to push it down everyones collective throat. Why is MS pushing something so hard when nobody asked for it? https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40611263

> It really doesn't [sound like a cool feature]. Not a single person I've spoken to likes the idea of this, at all https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40445335

> i have never wanted to go back in history [...] what’s the use case https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40544521

etc.

Re: Microsoft will switch off Recall by default after security backlash

#307

Post by whutsurnaym »

atribecalledqst wrote: post #260

Maybe a bit off-topic, but I sure wish they'd do this for OneDrive! I installed Windows for personal use for the first time recently (although I use it exclusively at work) and it drove me ABSOLUTELY BONKERS that my home drive was mapping to C:\Users\atribecalledqst\OneDrive. What I hated the most was that the File Explorer just calls the folders in there e.g. "Documents" and "Pictures" without showing the full path.…

I recently tried to fully rid myself of OneDrive and it took me over 48 hours to accomplish. The only working method I found involved fully enabling OneDrive, signing in, and waiting for a full sync. Only then was I able to tell it to stop syncing and finally remap Documents, Downloads, Pictures, etc.

The fact that I needed to log in, wait 24 hours for my account to unlock due to inactivity (!!!), and enable sync in order to disable it was enough for me to finally decide that Windows 10 will be my last Microsoft product. It may be a small annoyance, but to me it was the straw that broke the camel's back.

Re: Microsoft will switch off Recall by default after security backlash

#308

Post by blackeyeblitzar »

How about they remove ALL AI features, including Copilot? This is clearly illegal bundling that deserves swift anti-trust action. Microsoft is worse than ever, and far more bold with abuse of their market position than they ever were in the 90s.

Re: Microsoft will switch off Recall by default after security backlash

#309

Post by wvenable »

vondur wrote: post #173
SavageBeast wrote: post #126

In all the MS Recall drama, I've yet to hear or read one single person utter something to the effect of "Wow - great!!! - I've been waiting for something like this for years! This will solve at least one of the major issues I face regularly!". In fact, it seems to me the only people that really want this feature are the ones trying to push it down everyones collective throat. Why is MS pushing something so hard when…

It could be handy if the data was stored locally and was managed by the users.

It is.

Re: Microsoft will switch off Recall by default after security backlash

#310

Post by mostlysimilar »

listenallyall wrote: post #159
mostlysimilar wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Recall FEELS like being watched. Your browser history does not.

To be clear, I am not in favor of Recall or dismissing its intrusiveness. However, the correct comparison is not just "browser history". Google is also tracking your search history, passwords (built-in password manager), location history (Google Maps), ad clicks, and more. All-in, it's a LOT of data.

I'm with you -- I avoid Google products for the reasons you listed and am staunchly anti-surveillance capitalism. I just meant to say that even for a person with my very plugged-in perspective on these topics, Google's violations of my privacy still don't feel quite as invasive as Recall feels, even if on paper it's just as egregious and dangerous.
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