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FBI is warning people against using public phone-charging stations

schneier.com

301–310 of 328 posts

Re: FBI is warning people against using public phone-charging stations

#301

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> They'll plug in the phone, unlock it, and browse the internet. iOS devices (maybe Android too, idk) ask you if you want to allow new accessories to access your device. That's why they said you need an exploit.

If you attack the right part of the USB stack, the prompt and its answer dont matter.

If a malformed packet can trigger RCE in the USB stack, there wouldn’t be a prompt, right?

Re: FBI is warning people against using public phone-charging stations

#302
post #164
post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't get it, even after I reset my phone it's still locked, and by default not sharing data via USB. What am I missing?

If the USB connection truly doesn't get data, your charging experience is unsatisfactory: there's no way for the phone to negotiate higher wattage. Not "sharing data" doesn't really mean not sharing data.

[deleted]

Re: FBI is warning people against using public phone-charging stations

#303
post #248

Earlier quoted context omitted.

plz explain. I have something similar to these https://www.amazon.com/OffGrid-Blocker-Unwanted-Transfer-Pro... And it seems to charge quick enough (albeit never timed it)...

The way USB high power charging works is that unless the charger and the device agree on high power the charger just charges at the older pre-high power USB rate. That's why you can plug ancient devices into a high power charger without worry that they will get fried. The way the charger and the device agree on how much power the charger should supply involves the data lines. Thus, if you simply drill out the data li…

From what I’ve read, USB-A only had one pair of data pins and needed them to negotiate power delivery, but USB-C does not because it has a new configuration channel pin on each side (which is also used to negotiate modes for the many new data pairs, and detect being upside down).

A 24-pin “serial bus” might be getting a little crazy.

Re: FBI is warning people against using public phone-charging stations

#304
post #289

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I know I don’t but surely some people do perhaps hacker news is merely a conversation prompt aggregator

I mean the upstream comment is basically saying don't trust clicking any links on the Internet--even on a site that presumably weeds out really dodgy stuff quickly. Indeed, not using the Internet is a solid, if rather extreme, security process to follow.

I wrote it, and that’s not what it’s saying

Re: FBI is warning people against using public phone-charging stations

#305

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> but what can you really do? Get a USB condom, for instance, practice safer charging. :)

This is a joke, but it could actually be a thing. An isolator that you can use to protect your device while using those unknown ports. I would call it an isolator though, or firewall, not what you called it.

You can even make a type of them yourself with rudimentary equipment, by cutting the data lines and connecting/not cutting the power lines. I believe you will lose the ability to negotiate faster charging, and I don't know if USB-C will work at all, but it still works otherwise.

Re: FBI is warning people against using public phone-charging stations

#306

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not a joke, it's the (informal) industry term. See this for example: https://www.zdnet.com/article/protect-your-data-with-a-usb-c... https://lifehacker.com/use-a-usb-condom-to-protect-your-devi...

Cool, didn't know they exist.

Also now USB-C condom is also available, It was an issue since USB-C used data lines to negotiate voltage and I was tracking its need on my problem validation for a while now[1].

[1] https://needgap.com/problems/73-usb-type-c-condom-usb-cybers...

Re: FBI is warning people against using public phone-charging stations

#307

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Cool, didn't know they exist.

Also now USB-C condom is also available, It was an issue since USB-C used data lines to negotiate voltage and I was tracking its need on my problem validation for a while now[1]. [1] https://needgap.com/problems/73-usb-type-c-condom-usb-cybers...

> Also now USB-C condom is also available

Oh, I didn't know that! So what is the solution for USB-C? How do the new USB condoms work?

Re: FBI is warning people against using public phone-charging stations

#308

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> but what can you really do? Get a USB condom, for instance, practice safer charging. :)

Android asks me if I want to have a device to allow access, This probably prevents attacks against the upper layer protocols. Is the risk vector here the USB stack itself? I think its possible to disable the USB 'protocol' in Linux, but it would require advanced permissions on android, which probably doesn't work out of the box, with IOS who knows or cares.

> Is the risk vector here the USB stack itself?

Yes, exactly. There are some comments here in the thread that discuss this in detail.

Re: FBI is warning people against using public phone-charging stations

#309

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Also now USB-C condom is also available, It was an issue since USB-C used data lines to negotiate voltage and I was tracking its need on my problem validation for a while now[1]. [1] https://needgap.com/problems/73-usb-type-c-condom-usb-cybers...

> Also now USB-C condom is also available Oh, I didn't know that! So what is the solution for USB-C? How do the new USB condoms work?

I'm not completely sure, I read on reddit that USB-C condom has some form of proxy circuit to negotiate voltage; I hope someone with better knowledge in this can explain it better.

Re: FBI is warning people against using public phone-charging stations

#310
post #111

It really surprised me when this article blew up on Twitter as I thought it was common knowledge to never use public chargers and avoid untrusted usb anything after “bad usb”. It showed me how I live in a tech security bubble-a good reminder.

Many people, including many people on this site (and, yes, including myself) wouldn't think twice about plugging into an available port if they need a charge. Maybe I don't plug into an unlabeled port in some random location where it doesn't look like it belongs, but honestly I wouldn't think twice about charging at a designated area at a conference. (Though, yeah, I'd avoid a lot of "normal" activities if I ever att…

Which is exactly why they’re a great target. High traffic, good odds someone plugs the phone in and unlocks it while plugged in, etc.
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