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Tailscale raises $100M

tailscale.com

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Re: Tailscale raises $100M

#301

Post by samhw »

jjeaff wrote: post #297
_ktx2 wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

1Password went from being buy once upgrade forever to SaaS. A lot of folks bought back when that was the package (and business model) so it's viewed relatively negatively here from some folks. I don't blame them, but also, I think 1Password is a success. I just don't think they'd have been viable under their original business model.

But is "buy once, upgrade forever" really a viable long term business model?

I dunno, but you ought to figure it out (for your business) before you make that offer!

Re: Tailscale raises $100M

#302

Post by danenania »

criddell wrote: post #125
YPPH wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How has 1Password lost sight of its core values? Perhaps you refer to loss of local vaults? If so, they were never really a viable option for me - I needed the app syncing across multiple devices, including mobile, and doing so with a third party sync solution wasn't suitable.

For me, it was their switch to an Electron app. "High security" and "built from dozens of third party libraries and running on a browser" don't belong together.

Electron actually offers some of the best dependency-isolation capabilities of any language/platform given that you can set a content-security policy and leverage Chrome's extremely robust sandboxing to prevent front-end dependencies from accessing the file system, making network calls to untrusted domains, making system calls, calling 'eval', etc.

A fully native app will offer you no such protection. If a dependency used for styling or animations or whatever is compromised, it will have total access to the system and be able to exfiltrate at will to any location. In Electron, the equivalent dependencies can instead run inside the CSP sandbox, preventing them from doing any serious harm.

Supply chain vulnerabilities also aren't unique to npm. Any project that uses dependencies (in any language) has the same issue.

Re: Tailscale raises $100M

#303

Post by [deleted] »

oicU00 wrote: post #165
shepherdjerred wrote: post #152

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It handles a lot more than that, right? It does all of the key distribution and rotation which is a pain.

If they can do it it’s not impossible (they’re just people after all). With an open source implementation out there, anyone can do it merely pulling a Docker container, and without paying Tailscale. Regardless I manage a dozen users with no issue using Embarks container; once they’re setup I touch nothing. Paying people is not working with people; it’s working with a specific group. Open source is working with people…

[deleted]

Re: Tailscale raises $100M

#304

Post by lupire »

rhuber wrote: post #216
crawshaw wrote: post #208

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tailscalar here. Tailscale can handle 100k+ nodes with lots of churn just fine.

Fair enough. I am sure the key distribution is fast and all that, but not needing peer key distribution at all was a goal and the overhead associated is less scalable than just not doing it at all. Regardless, very cool that you can handle that many nodes, which is a hard problem. I assume you do just-in-time key distribution or something, because (n-1) distribution of peer keys would be ... less than ideal. Anywho,…

> the overhead associated is less scalable than just not doing it at all

That's only true if you can actually articulate a reason why it won't scale to some matbitut that some user might actually need today or at some point in the future.

For example, Go may be "not as scalable at C" (or vice versa! Or both!), but what matters is the scale to which it is actually desired to be deployed.

Re: Tailscale raises $100M

#306

Post by samhw »

oicU00 wrote: post #165
shepherdjerred wrote: post #152

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It handles a lot more than that, right? It does all of the key distribution and rotation which is a pain.

If they can do it it’s not impossible (they’re just people after all). With an open source implementation out there, anyone can do it merely pulling a Docker container, and without paying Tailscale. Regardless I manage a dozen users with no issue using Embarks container; once they’re setup I touch nothing. Paying people is not working with people; it’s working with a specific group. Open source is working with people…

If the open source implementation is equally good, I'm sure people will use that instead of Tailscale. That Tailscale exists makes me suspect that the open source implementation - as is usually the case with these "just use curlftpfs!" comments – is not equally good.

The reality is that making software, like any other human endeavour, takes time and energy. Paying one another money is a rather well-established mechanism of rewarding and incentivising that time and energy (since not everyone wants to work free of charge to make and maintain software for you, out of the goodness of their hearts, no matter how much you insist that you're owed their unpaid labour).

There are small and local means of getting free food, or free woodworking, etc, but the general reality is that a high-quality high-dependency maintained product, over the long term, is more feasible when it's paid.

Re: Tailscale raises $100M

#307

Post by fullstackchris »

fullstackchris wrote: post #305

Crap... is this literally the product I've been MVPing the past few weeks? ( https://kurynt.com ) - or do I still have a chance? Full disclosure - there is little to no functionality yet, but the homepage is enough

OK, reading the comments it is a totally different product, but I guess I have to try it!

"Zero config VPN. Installs on any device in minutes, manages firewall rules for you, and works from anywhere."

Okay... at first I said to myself, _no way_. But then I thought, "Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic."

Re: Tailscale raises $100M

#308

Post by fullstackchris »

newhouseb wrote: post #7

Tailscale is my favorite (product) discovery of 2022. I initially set it up to use as a VPN to get around a misbehaving corporate firewall and accidentally realized it solved a whole bunch of other problems I didn't realize I had. Usually a new product doesn't even live up to the intended use case and so TS is really anomalous IMHO in how good it is. - SSH'ing into a raspberry pi I have at home that does random IoT s…

But HOW can this work? It MUST have config level access to each machine, that's the only way I can see this working. I guess I just have to try it to see.

Re: Tailscale raises $100M

#309

Post by throw0101a »

legalcorrection wrote: post #264
throw0101a wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Yeah, no one is going to allow unsolicited inbound connections even without NAT so you still have to have something to hook up the two ends in a P2P setting. Sure they are. All home routers that I'm aware of allow for port forwarding so folks can self-host a service: perhaps a game server (e.g., Minecraft), web, e-mail, etc. It's just going forward you can set up a separate subnet to put your gear in (especially if…

The point is for the user to not have to go configure their firewall.

Which can be done via UPnP and PCP, and without having to maintain TURN/STUN/etc infrastructure. The latter of which can only be done with IPv6, since with IPv4 you're NATing.

So IPv6 makes things easier—which was the point of my post: IPv6 makes things easier.

Re: Tailscale raises $100M

#310

Post by pkulak »

Sohcahtoa82 wrote: post #286
gzer0 wrote: post #137

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am able to route traffic on my mobile device through my home network via the use of their "exit node" option. It allows one of my home devices to act as an exit node for my entire personal tailscale network. This serves multiple benefits: the main one being that I receive pi-hole filtered ad-free traffic on my mobile device via a Wireguard VPN with my home IP 24/7/365

What other benefits are there? I use a PiHole to block ads on my phone already, but I do it via a PiHole installed on an EC2 instance that I also use as an IRC bouncer and other things.

It means you can self host all kinds of things and never worry about opening a port on your router.
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