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Rocket Mortgage to trim 8% of workforce as home-loan market shrinks

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Re: Rocket Mortgage to trim 8% of workforce as home-loan market shrinks

#301

Post by tannedNerd »

sokoloff wrote: post #266
tannedNerd wrote: post #249

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And now your company you invested is worth half because they were too strict on loaning and have entered the death spiral where they aren’t bringing enough new loans in and fold or get bought out for much less then your original stock price.

That requires the profit from the number of loan originations to non-W2 workers to be enough higher than the costs and errors produced by detailed human underwriting (against adversarial applicants, which both W2 and non-W2 applicants are, but W2s are harder to fudge). It’s surely possible for that assumption to be true, but I start out skeptical.

You are making the assumption that they are also not overly strict for w2. Ive found that if one is not willing to budge on one thing its usually like that across the board

Re: Rocket Mortgage to trim 8% of workforce as home-loan market shrinks

#302

Post by tannedNerd »

afavour wrote: post #257
tannedNerd wrote: post #249

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And now your company you invested is worth half because they were too strict on loaning and have entered the death spiral where they aren’t bringing enough new loans in and fold or get bought out for much less then your original stock price.

What percentage of mortgages are given to self employed folks? Genuine question, I have no idea. But I wouldn’t assume it’s enough that it could rescue any company from a death spiral.

You are making the assumption that they are also not overly strict for w2. Ive found that if one is not willing to budge on one thing its usually like that across the board

Re: Rocket Mortgage to trim 8% of workforce as home-loan market shrinks

#303

Post by pavon »

redshirtrob wrote: post #237

Has anyone actually used Rocket? Every time I (or a friend) have looked at them they have higher closing costs and wanted multiple points to close the mortgage. I was able to do way, way better by going with a local bank, as did my friends. The only thing I can figure is they are better for folks with "good" (not "excellent") credit and can maybe close the loan faster.

I refinanced with them, but mostly because the salesman I talked to were misinformed or intentionally lied about some detail of how they could do FHA refinance which made them sound like a better deal than everyone else I compared against. I don't remember the details (it was a long time ago) and the information they gave had been true at sometime in the past, but had expired. In the end, they had slightly (negligibly) better rates than the rest after factoring in the points, and I had already paid deposit money.

Despite that bad start, I was very happy with how they serviced the loan. They didn't play any games or make things harder than it needed to be. If you sent in extra money they both applied it to the principle immediately, and pushed your next payment date out accordingly (and cumulatively), so you could retroactively treat it as a prepayment if something came up. This was really nice, and none of my other mortgages have done both - the better ones automatically applied it to the principle, and the worse ones treated it as prepayment unless you jumped through hoops to inform them otherwise each payment. I did end up taking advantage of this to help get through some unexpected medical expenses.

Paying off the loan was also trivial - just sent in the last payment and the loan was done and they sent me the necessary documentation. That is how all my car loans have worked, but for some reason previous mortgages have required some extra steps for the final payoff, or the mortgage ends up in some weird purgatory state.

Re: Rocket Mortgage to trim 8% of workforce as home-loan market shrinks

#304

Post by jjav »

darrenf wrote: post #171
hans1729 wrote: post #118

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Going into debt at the lowest interest rate you'll ever be offered to buy a leveraged asset that's likely to increase in price and reduce the overhead you pay on your largest expense, housing, and hedge against the risk of rent increases and security against the whims of landlords? Look, if I had enough money around, I'd maybe consider the gamble. But I don't want to buy property to sell it later, I just want to li…

I spent most of my 20s thinking, man, fuck home ownership, I'm gonna rent forever (to my knowledge, no-one in my family had ever owned; I grew up in charity housing and inherited nothing at all). Then I got booted out of a place because the landlord wanted to sell. They offered it to me first, but I had no savings for a deposit. The same story played out amongst my friends, repeatedly, and it totally changed my mind.…

> and multiple 2-6 month breaks between jobs, all affordable because I owned rather than rented

Indeed! I've taken a long break from working to be with my child, which I could afford to do only because I'd bought a home years earlier. If I'd been renting with ever-increasing rents I never could have done that.

Re: Rocket Mortgage to trim 8% of workforce as home-loan market shrinks

#305

Post by onlyrealcuzzo »

Sohcahtoa82 wrote: post #297
bitexploder wrote: post #184

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Most of Denver region had been hot as well.

I've heard Denver is extremely popular because you have all the amenities of a big city (They even have a Six Flags!), yet is right next to beautiful mountains and nature. Some parts even still have a small town feel. Of course, I've also heard that a significant fraction of those moving in are single men, to the point where the city has gotten the nickname "Menver".

Aside from Six Flags, how is this different from the west of the US?

Re: Rocket Mortgage to trim 8% of workforce as home-loan market shrinks

#306

Post by lotsofpulp »

lmt55 wrote: post #276
lotsofpulp wrote: post #192

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>After all the boomer generation, on average, has over-provisioned for old age, whereas millenials are still underhoused. Have they over-provisioned? Everything I have read indicates meager savings for the vast majority of the population, who will need to rely on Medicaid and Social Security to eek out the remainder of their living costs. Nursing home care is especially costly in the event one does not die quickly, a…

I think the reality is more subtle. A large number of poorer elder people will be in dire financial straits, forced to work beyond their ability to do so and unable to pay for health care. However there are also a smaller number of extremely rich baby boomers and a very large number of comfortable middle-class ones. The former will obviously pass on large amounts of wealth. The latter have been forced to save large a…

I think you might be referring to top 10% of households.

https://dqydj.com/net-worth-by-age-calculator-united-states/

75th percentile gets to only $800k by age 70, and that is including the equity in their home. Maybe the beneficiaries of the 70% to 90% households will end up with real estate worth a few hundred thousand, but I do not see much wealth being passed down beyond that.

Labor is only going to get more expensive as greater proportions of the population age out of the workforce and become labor buyers rather than suppliers. Unless many start dying younger than anticipated without using a lot of medical and nursing home care, I would not expect much if I was their descendant.

Re: Rocket Mortgage to trim 8% of workforce as home-loan market shrinks

#307

Post by Sohcahtoa82 »

kortilla wrote: post #94
JetAlone wrote: post #90

Buying a home mortgage is signing yourself over to a lifetime of servitude and uncertainty if you lose your income stream. Buy a property out of pocket to live in and make the most of a DIY life at a fraction of the cost and an odd stress differential, or just keep renting and be agile enough to roll with the punches.

Getting a mortgage is the easiest way to build wealth through government subsidized leverage (mortgage interest deduction).

First off, it's a deduction, not a credit. You're still spending money.

Second, your mortgage interest (plus other deductions) need to be high enough to warrant itemizing deductions. At the start of 2021, my mortgage balance was $270K with a rate of 2.275%. Even including a $7,000 donation to charity, it wasn't enough for my wife and I to itemize.

That said, it's much better to mortgage than pay cash for reasons outlined already in this thread.

Re: Rocket Mortgage to trim 8% of workforce as home-loan market shrinks

#308

Post by jjav »

ilammy wrote: post #131
hans1729 wrote: post #118

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Going into debt at the lowest interest rate you'll ever be offered to buy a leveraged asset that's likely to increase in price and reduce the overhead you pay on your largest expense, housing, and hedge against the risk of rent increases and security against the whims of landlords? Look, if I had enough money around, I'd maybe consider the gamble. But I don't want to buy property to sell it later, I just want to li…

> I'm not interested in placing bets on my salary That's exactly what you already do if you're renting: you're betting that you will be able to work and earn enough salary to afford the rent, with your adjusted expenses. That's "pfft easy" when you're in 20's, easy in your 30's, okay in your 40's (kids need money, yo), doable in your 50's, oh shit when you're 52 because surprise! economic downturn / medical emergency…

> And now you don't have a place to live in and spending your retirement money to rent one, or take a dip in your quality of life.

As you say, keeping up with rent is easy (not necessarily, but for those in professional careers) early in life, but as your income plateaus later in your career it starts to become harder to keep up with relentless rent increases.

But then it's in retirement that a lifetime of renting really hurts. Suddenly you have no income anymore other than whatever small retirement benefits if any, but rents keep going up.

Re: Rocket Mortgage to trim 8% of workforce as home-loan market shrinks

#309

Post by mminer237 »

eli_gottlieb wrote: post #288
xadhominemx wrote: post #207

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The true demand from people with the intend to actually live in the estates has been constantly decreasing since around 2000; the real salarys dropped since then, so did the buying power. > When 90 (?) percent of people simply lack the buying power to participate in the real estate market, but the other 10% happily sell each other estates, that's not a bubble, the real estate market just stopped interfacing with th…

>Nonsense. The home ownership rate is 65%, in-line with the long term average and the same as it was in the year 2000 The homeownership rate is counted in terms of households, no? So it can be kept artificially high just by having 20-somethings no longer move out of their parents' houses.

That wouldn't count against it, but it wouldn't count for it either.

Re: Rocket Mortgage to trim 8% of workforce as home-loan market shrinks

#310

Post by strikelaserclaw »

tibbar wrote: post #3

I don’t have a good way to reconcile the current hot job market with seemingly increasing reports of mass layoffs, but one wonders if the graph will change directions decisively at some point soon.

Yea, we are already seeing glimpses of it. The last two years have been an exuberant time for cheap money, i think we will soon see an employer market, which might mean bad things for WFH.
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