Building a vision of life without work (2015) • Hacker News Board

Re: Building a vision of life without work (2015)

#301

Post by walletburst » Tue, Jul 13, 2021, 8:20 PM UTC

yarcob wrote: post #221

balfirevic wrote: post #194

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> they might be better off scaling back to a sustainable 40hr/week job 40hr/week is the unsustainable part.

40h/week of work leaves very little time for household, kids, exercise, side projects, and relaxing. I think 20h/week is a more reasonable target if you want to enjoy things beside work. Of course it's okay to work 40h/week if you really want to, or even more, if you enjoy it, but you should really think hard about whether that's really what you want, or if it's just what your employer wants you to do.

This is where I think the concept of "coasting" to financial independence could be beneficial for many. The idea is that you build up enough investments early in life such that without any additional contributions, your net worth will grow to support retirement at a traditional retirement age. Then you just need to make enough money to cover your monthly living expenses, which could open up a lot more career options that better fit your desired lifestyle.

https://walletburst.com/tools/coast-fire-calc

Re: Building a vision of life without work (2015)

#302

Post by war1025 » Tue, Jul 13, 2021, 8:24 PM UTC

opportune wrote: post #197

kevinwang wrote: post #5

This person also posted an amazing, unvarnished update recently (about 5-6 years later): https://livingafi.com/2021/03/17/the-2021-early-retirement-u...

I really don’t like how he tries to diminish his partner’s feeling about “falling behind” as some mirage created by Instagram and classism. I think it’s pretty uncontroversial that most people don’t want to live on $30k/year for their entire life when they could maybe work and get more. Though maybe this is colored by the relevation that follows shortly thereafter. To me it shows an unwillingness to think critically…

> I think it’s pretty uncontroversial that most people don’t want to live on $30k/year

One thing that I missed the first time this article got posted is that he and his (ex)wife had separate finances.

He had an income of 30k/year, she presumably had a similar income.

Living on 60k/year seems like a whole different ballgame than 30k/year.

Re: Building a vision of life without work (2015)

#303

Post by metalex » Tue, Jul 13, 2021, 8:25 PM UTC

bserge wrote: post #195

metalex wrote: post #145

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This article makes me really sad. I know this is just my perspective, but this person isn't living -- they're just existing. What are they striving for? Consuming media?

That's a personal matter. Inside our brain we have two sides - the more primitive brain that just needs safety/food/reproduction/entertainment and the more advanced side that needs to plan and do stuff otherwise it questions it's existence. People have a different balance of either, so some are happy with just living while others need to do something, anything beyond the basics. Neither is wrong from a personal point…

Maslow's hierarchy of needs :) I feel like having the food/water/shelter covered isn't enough - fortunate folks eventually hit the self-actualization point. Sounds like the author is now finding more meaning with starting a family (props to him).

Re: Building a vision of life without work (2015)

#304

Post by hutzlibu » Tue, Jul 13, 2021, 8:25 PM UTC

UncleOxidant wrote: post #290

zoba wrote: post #67

I was 2nd employee at a unicorn startup and have been on a work-hiatus for almost a year. Now, I live amongst Amish people in the country. My biggest insight has been a mindset change. Previously my underlying approach to life looked like: "I will do X which will enable me to do Y so that I can finally do Z." I now approach my days with "What will make me happy?" This is an experiment I'm performing. A structured lif…

> As an example, turns out I really enjoy building dams. Sorry to go off on a tangent, but this really has me wondering. How big of a dam are we talking here? Is it actually legal to build a private dam?

"Is it actually legal to build a private dam? "

Not likely. Unless it is a very small stream.

Re: Building a vision of life without work (2015)

#305

Post by psyc » Tue, Jul 13, 2021, 8:25 PM UTC

AlexTWithBeard wrote: post #297

yarcob wrote: post #221

Earlier quoted context omitted.

40h/week of work leaves very little time for household, kids, exercise, side projects, and relaxing. I think 20h/week is a more reasonable target if you want to enjoy things beside work. Of course it's okay to work 40h/week if you really want to, or even more, if you enjoy it, but you should really think hard about whether that's really what you want, or if it's just what your employer wants you to do.

> 20h/week That's what I have an issue with. When I'm working on a problem, I cannot simply forget about it at 3pm and head to the beach to enjoy life. The problem will be in my head 24/7 until one of us gives up.

In my 20s, I was very much like this. When I was struggling with burnout, an older colleague told me that when he leaves the building, he shuts work off entirely and enjoys unrelated things. At the time, hearing this frustrated me because I couldn't even begin to fathom which muscle one would flex in order to "shut off" thinking about work.

But now I'm the age that he was back then, and I find I can compartmentalize or turn off work thinking easily. I'm not suggesting it's a factor of age, exactly, but perhaps some other change that occurs over time? Not really sure, but something in my head definitely changed.

Re: Building a vision of life without work (2015)

#306

Post by benhurmarcel » Tue, Jul 13, 2021, 8:26 PM UTC

mgh2 wrote: post #110

zoba wrote: post #67

I was 2nd employee at a unicorn startup and have been on a work-hiatus for almost a year. Now, I live amongst Amish people in the country. My biggest insight has been a mindset change. Previously my underlying approach to life looked like: "I will do X which will enable me to do Y so that I can finally do Z." I now approach my days with "What will make me happy?" This is an experiment I'm performing. A structured lif…

We were built to work, to have purpose. Having meaningful work is key - this is what the FIRE movement misunderstood. By meaningful, I mean to someone other your yourself or your extended self (family). Our purpose is to serve others, not ourselves.

We weren't built, we just happen to have evolved. There is no higher purpose.

See, your life philosophy isn't universal.

Re: Building a vision of life without work (2015)

#307

Post by benhurmarcel » Tue, Jul 13, 2021, 8:29 PM UTC

michalf6 wrote: post #59

Society which values work will outcompete the one which does not. You and people around you aren't the only ones on this planet, there are highly motivated people elsewhere who will gladly put in effort to take your place.

> Society which values work will outcompete the one which does not.

Why should one care about helping one "society" at the expense of another?

> there are highly motivated people elsewhere who will gladly put in effort to take your place

If I already have enough to be happy they're welcome to do so.

Re: Building a vision of life without work (2015)

#308

Post by [deleted] » Tue, Jul 13, 2021, 8:31 PM UTC

Nemrod67 wrote: post #25

AnIdiotOnTheNet wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I feel you. I don't know if it is the pandemic or I've just reached mid-life-crisis age, but I'm so ready to not be working that I'm considering just quitting right now and killing myself when the money eventually runs out.

please don't kill yourself, there needs to be more people being fed up for things to move, not less :)

[deleted]

Re: Building a vision of life without work (2015)

#309

Post by germinalphrase » Tue, Jul 13, 2021, 8:32 PM UTC

AnIdiotOnTheNet wrote: post #45

solarengineer wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I recently played out this scenario where I run out of money and then just end myself instead of begging. I concluded that I'm extremely likely to be doing something meaningful and would rather have the survival money. So that's what I'm focused on now - working on my bucket list, moving towards meaningful activities already and figuring out how much I'd need to becoming financially independent. The Bogleheads websit…

> For those who like the Marvel movies, I think Tony Stark ended up doing rather well with the gift of life that he'd received in the first Iron Man movie. A fictional superhuman-level engineer may not be the best example you could use here.

I think the point is that Stark wasn’t shown having extensive personal friendships, family life, etc. - but he used what he did have (technical ability) to do meaningful work. Obviously, the scope of that work is fantastical, but what’s the point of storytelling if we don’t take inspiration from our characters?

Re: Building a vision of life without work (2015)

#310

Post by war1025 » Tue, Jul 13, 2021, 8:34 PM UTC

kerkeslager wrote: post #95

temp8964 wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Of course people can choose not having spouse or kids. What do you mean there is zero alternative? There are people born rich enough to not have to work, but do they live a happy life by not working all the way?

> Of course people can choose not having spouse or kids. What do you mean there is zero alternative? You're doing that thing where you claim there's freedom of choice because you're ignoring the punishment inflicted on one choice. The choice not to commit to a long-term relationship has had severe financial implications for centuries, especially if you are female. Until the invention of effective birth control, the c…

> the choice to not have children meant giving up much of heterosexual sex.

A bit personal maybe, but my wife has never been on birth control, we don't use protection, and have never had an "oops" baby. We had kids when we wanted kids, and haven't had kids when we didn't want kids.

It's really just... not that hard...