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Germany pauses AstraZeneca vaccinations as a 'precaution'

reuters.com

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Re: Germany pauses AstraZeneca vaccinations as a 'precaution'

#301

Post by leereeves »

mynameisvlad wrote: post #300
ArkanExplorer wrote: post #277

Earlier quoted context omitted.

https://www.statista.com/statistics/525353/sweden-number-of-... Sweden, 2020 deaths only 6.2% higher than 2018, and following a weak 2019 flu season. These are entirely acceptable death figures within the context of aging European societies. COVID is basically a once-a-decade flu variant: like Swine Flu in 2009, which came and went without lockdown: https://swprs.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/10/sweden-monthly-... So C…

> Or alternatively, they wish to push the vaccines and end of lockdown into Spring/Summer, where natural seasonality will take care of COVID and give the appearance that lockdown and vaccines were a success. Did you somehow forget that this is the second year of Covid? We've already gone through the whole "natural seasonality" cycle and the disease is very much still here.

Take a look at this COVID daily trends graph from the CDC:

https://covid.cdc.gov/covid-data-tracker/#trends_dailytrends...

From an average of about 50k cases reported daily in April through October to about 200k cases reported daily in November, December, and January, then back down to 60k by March.

And there's a similar winter increase in the worldwide cases (some of which is from the US cases, but not all):

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/worldwide-graphs/#...

It's impossible to be sure after just one year, but that hill in the winter certainly suggests a seasonal illness to me.

Re: Germany pauses AstraZeneca vaccinations as a 'precaution'

#302

Post by tazjin »

sradman wrote: post #206
fab1an wrote: post #133

Looks like this may be a bit more relevant than many of the snarky comments would suggest - the relevant German authority on this said that they have seen a unexpected increase in a specific type of blood clotting issue that usually is very rare: https://www.pei.de/DE/newsroom/hp-meldungen/2021/210315-voru...

> The EMA has said that as of March 10, a total of 30 cases of blood clotting had been reported among close to 5 million people vaccinated with the AstraZeneca shot in the European Economic Area, which links 30 European countries. "The decision today is purely precautionary..." given this level of signal. We don't have details on the age groups involved and the normal rates expected but I can hazard a Fermi Estimate…

> the risk is minuscule compared to COVID-19 itself

You don't know this at all - we don't know what age groups are affected here, and COVID is pretty much negligible in many younger age groups. It's best to wait for more data to come in before drawing any conclusions.

Re: Germany pauses AstraZeneca vaccinations as a 'precaution'

#303

Post by Retric »

ktybdr wrote: post #184
lxgr wrote: post #147

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Thats why everyone should be free to chose to get vaccinated. Isn't that the case? At least in my country, there is no obligation to take the vaccine, and even incentives (e.g. being able to attend public events sooner) are seen very critically.

There are definitely people with the view that they should be mandatory and I've personally started to encounter social pressure to get vaccinated, which I don't want to do, because I lead a low-contact hermit's life and the odds of dying from COVID which I probably won't catch if I maintain my lifestyle a few more months appears to be lower than the chance I'll die from a vaccine that I definitely get For my age coh…

Assuming your odds of catching COVID is 1 in 1,000 that’s still a higher risk for any adult age group than the vaccines. I doubt your risk of catching covid is actually that low.

More importantly it’s not just about avoiding death, a bad case of COVID is terrible even if you survive. On top of this you reduce the risk of spreading it to someone else.

Re: Germany pauses AstraZeneca vaccinations as a 'precaution'

#304

Post by jonplackett »

DoingIsLearning wrote: post #28
jonplackett wrote: post #5

Maybe AZ should have charged €3 per shot instead of €2 and spent the extra € on a PR agency. They just seem to be constantly taking a hammering in the press, unfairly I’d say.

To be fair, I think the contract between AZ and Oxford University actually restricts them from making a profit for a period of N months/years. So they are only technically allowed to adjust the price to take into account the different operational costs depending on the manufacturing site.

Yes I did know that (I’m just being silly really) but even so, PR is a cost and so they wouldn’t even be making any more profit!

I do think people aren’t giving AZ enough credit for doing it at cost though. Especially compared to the €50 per dose Pfizer initially quoted the EU!

Re: Germany pauses AstraZeneca vaccinations as a 'precaution'

#305

Post by mywacaday »

elliekelly wrote: post #271
mywacaday wrote: post #224

Poor reporting to not include that Italy, France, Ireland, Bulgaria, Denmark and The Netherlands have all paused the vaccine along with Norway which is mentioned. Expect better of Reuters.

The very first sentence of the article makes it clear that Germany is neither the first nor only European country to suspend AZ vaccinations: > making it the latest of several European countries to hit pause The article also cites the EMA, an EU institution, and notes: > Several EU countries have called a halt to the AstraZeneca vaccine Would you have them list each and every country individually? It seems, to me, th…

Yes, or at the very least the number of countries that have paused the vaccine, this is a rapidly changing story and where this reporting lands in the narrative is important. I had to go check anothe news site to see which/how many EU countries had now paused the Astra Zennica vaccine.

Re: Germany pauses AstraZeneca vaccinations as a 'precaution'

#306

Post by jonplackett »

Kaido wrote: post #268
jonplackett wrote: post #5

Maybe AZ should have charged €3 per shot instead of €2 and spent the extra € on a PR agency. They just seem to be constantly taking a hammering in the press, unfairly I’d say.

It was totally deserved, the EU helped fund the vaccine with a €336 million grant and what they did was stopping the exports from the UK plants to the EU while still exporting from the EU to the UK.No wonder that they didn't delivered the promised doses since their best efforts were being allocated to the UK.

I know they accused AZ of this but as far as I know there is no evidence. Do you have a source?

Re: Germany pauses AstraZeneca vaccinations as a 'precaution'

#307

Post by _Microft »

Zenst wrote: post #149
Nursie wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A bunch of friends of mine have spent a couple of days pretty whacked by it. Tiredness and a few headaches mostly. Make sure to get plenty of water and rest :)

Get them to look at https://yellowcard.mhra.gov.uk/ and report their side effects. That's the UK system for reporting side effects in medications of any form. Also weekly report of the covid-19 vaccine side effects here: https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/coronavirus-covid... Had my jab 3 hours ago, and enjoying a nice honey dew pomelo as I type thinking, fruit just don't get any better than this.

Just because we are at a medical topic and you are mentioning pomelos: they contain a substance (naringin) that can interfere with certain drugs. Just fyi

Re: Germany pauses AstraZeneca vaccinations as a 'precaution'

#308

Post by tlogan »

yayr wrote: post #25
greenpresident wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Casual estimates are at 1700/week. https://mobile.twitter.com/politicsforali/status/13714790084...

this does not seem to be official the usual figure now is 5 Million vaccinations and 30 reported deaths from blood clotting. Which appears to be not much different from the number without vaccinations. https://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/oxford-astrazeneca-vaccin...

My understanding is that they were 30 blood clotting cases - not deaths. Am I correct?

Re: Germany pauses AstraZeneca vaccinations as a 'precaution'

#309

Post by draw_down »

tazjin wrote: post #302
sradman wrote: post #206

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The EMA has said that as of March 10, a total of 30 cases of blood clotting had been reported among close to 5 million people vaccinated with the AstraZeneca shot in the European Economic Area, which links 30 European countries. "The decision today is purely precautionary..." given this level of signal. We don't have details on the age groups involved and the normal rates expected but I can hazard a Fermi Estimate…

> the risk is minuscule compared to COVID-19 itself You don't know this at all - we don't know what age groups are affected here, and COVID is pretty much negligible in many younger age groups. It's best to wait for more data to come in before drawing any conclusions.

There is such a discursive wall around the vaccines, there is no quarter for any idea that one of the vaccines could have risks that should give anyone pause. Covid will kill you, vaccines will save you, end of story.

Re: Germany pauses AstraZeneca vaccinations as a 'precaution'

#310

Post by jedberg »

Three weeks ago I was debating someone here on HN, defending the FDAs choice to deny approval of the AZ vaccine. I pointed out that while the FDA can be conservative compared to the EU, they have a strong track record of being right.

Thalidomide is the most well known example, but there are many others:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lumiracoxib -- Approved in Europe, not the USA. Withdrawn from sales due to side effects.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zimelidine -- Same.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tolrestat -- Approved in Europe, failed stage 3 clinical in the USA

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rimonabant -- Approved in Europe, failed in the USA, withdrawn worldwide because the side effects were so bad.

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