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What happened to Mint?

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Re: What happened to Mint?

#301

The killer feature I am waiting for is any site or app with automatic transaction importing from my bank without requiring me to input my online banking password and thus being one data breach away from someone having full access to all my accounts (sms-based 2FA notwithstanding) This is a solved problem in tech (OAuth, I think) so clearly there are perverse financial incentives (ie. my bank doesn't want to make it e…

It’s my understanding that banks in the EU must make their APIs public after PSD2. So...regulation is about the only thing they will get the incumbent to share their data

Re: What happened to Mint?

#302

Earlier quoted context omitted.

USAA's checking/savings accounts have most of those features. You can connect external bank and investment accounts. Track home value. Categorize transactions. There's more features, those are just the ones I know about. That said, I still use Personal Capital to track my finances.

Out of curiosity, why do you prefer Personal Capital to USAA?

I think @Richicoder is right. USAA's tools haven't been updated in a while and are a pain to use. Their tech is still really good for a US bank. Personal Capital has been pretty painless (besides the occasional bank/investment syncing issues). Personal Capital's investment and retirement tools are quite nice. The only downside to Personal Capital is their advisors calling to try and sell their service. I eventually blocked their numbers and haven't heard anything from them in years.

A long time ago I used Mint. If I remember correctly, I had tons of syncing issues and problems navigating their UI. I tried USAA for a while, but eventually stumbled upon Personal Capital. I passionately dislike Intuit due to their pricing practices of Quickbooks Online, so I'd never use Mint again ;)

Re: What happened to Mint?

#303

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Came here to say this. I use both and Personal Capital works better for investments than Mint and Mint for other things. I am still not satisfied with Mint Budgeting and I am currently trying YNAB. Mint sync with banks works better than all and YNAB is not intuitive to use (at least for me) . Maybe I am not the right demographic.

Same situation, I'm religious with budgeting in Mint, and Personal Capital gives me my over all net worth progress.

The Mint trends let you look at net worth and income over time... what makes Personal Capital so much better for looking at net worth progress? Genuinely curious because I might switch over if there's actual differentiation.

Re: What happened to Mint?

#304

Co-founder of a (yet to be launched) Mint competitor here [1]. One pattern I think we all see over and over again is when products get bought by a large company, they often lose their "soul" (and the original team). Both those things happened with Mint. Another important pattern I've seen is that products, in the long-term, morph to take the form of their revenue model. Many personal finance products are free, but ma…

I’ve looked at a lot of budgeting apps. In order of priority, I want: 1. Don’t be evil (aka don’t be intuit) 2. Web based with some sane security (2fa, encryption at rest, etc) 3. The ability to sync transactions from my bank. 4. Budgeting/reporting. 5. Some sort of sane forecasting. You’ve got N months of data from a customer, why can’t you tell them in 6 months this account is expected to have $x in it? 6. Sane API…

> 4. Budgeting/reporting.

> 5. Some sort of sane forecasting. You’ve got N months of data from a customer, why can’t you tell them in 6 months this account is expected to have $x in it?

I work on a methodology engine and have implemented both of these, at least on the data side, and they are essentially aspects of the same thing.

Fundamentally, what's hard is user trust. If they see numbers that don't make sense, explaining that "technically you told us this and this which all adds up to that" sounds like "we can't do arithemtic" to users.

The budget needs to agree with the forecasts. And the forecast doesn't quite semantically "fit" the budget; your forecast shouldn't "know" about the future or it can't give faithful metrics whereas your budget is supposed to plan ahead.

It also gets tricky when people use the damned thing, because your system needs to be resilient to users not doing the things they promised to do. For example, if they promise to deposit $500 in projected account A, but instead deposit it in tracked account B, you would project that the money lands in A, and also report that there's $500 more in B. So now those totals are off.

And budgeting itself is a surprisingly tricky problem. There are so many techniques to make a budget work that selecting good ones is hard. And users will say, "oh, I always want to spend $500 on this," and when that results in something stupid, "well, obviously not then." Even without that, it's hard to make the budget not do weird stuff that gives a user a WTF moment. The most counter-intuitive stuff tends to happen when the person is running low on funds, but that's also the raison d'etre of a budget.

> 3. The ability to sync transactions from my bank.

> 6. Sane APIs.

Between not making money off the APIs, having the user get frustrated being bounced between my support and the competitor, and that the APIs become another component that must be secured and administered, I'm not surprised APIs are uncommon.

Which makes me sad.

Re: What happened to Mint?

#305
post #142

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm still on v4, it works great and I had to pay for it once. I know the model is subscriptions these days and $7/mo ($84/annual purchase) really is nothing in the big picture but it still bugs me. Looking through their release notes it doesn't appear that there has been major improvements in the budgeting aspect of the software. If you've used v4 is it worth it?

I'd go check the YNAB forums, there's a lot of v4 users who really hate the cloud version. I tried to switch and gave it up for two reasons: - Import from v4 is super broken for credit card accounts and I ended up with weird positive balances that don't add up based on any combination of transactions. Forum advice was "start over". - You cannot tag income as "available for next month", instead all income must be imme…

Longtime YNAB user here. It was rough moving to nYNAB at first, and I missed features for awhile. It's generally caught up and surpassed YNAB 4 in most respects. Things I still miss: the red right arrow (good reason to abandon it, but I still liked it), and being able to see three months side-by-side. Starting over occasionally is not a bad thing, IMO, and I did a fresh start with nYNAB. I created a "Next Month's Income" category, and use it exactly like YNAB 4; I don't budget beyond the current month. It woekd just fine that way. I generally ignore "Age of Money", which took over as the "Live on Last Month's Income" rule, and still follow the latter.

Re: What happened to Mint?

#306
post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You might like Tiller Money. It's basically the bank integration that Mint and YNAB have, but instead of being forced to use their interface it backs out the data into an Excel/Google spreadsheet that you can build your own system on top of. (It costs money, but after what happened to Mint I consider "sustainable business model that doesn't involve selling your data" a feature for this sort of service.)

Only allowing logins via google is highly disappointing, and makes tiller unusable for me. The last thing I want to associate with my google account is my financial data.

While I can understand not wanting to create a Google account (even just to use as a login), my understanding is that if you use Tiller via Excel, Google will not have access to any of your financial data.

Re: What happened to Mint?

#307

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Mint never really lost its soul. It always seemed like it was going to try and upsell me on stuff, but that was fine by me because I'm not in the market for new credit cards or whatever. But I guess that's part of the problem, and they're just not making much money off referrals and therefore can't be bothered to improve the product? The problem for me with Mint is that it just... stopped getting any updates, and the…

To me, the lack of updates is Mint losing its soul. What was refreshing and different about Mint for me is that they said, "Hey, what if we really look at how people deal with their money and design accordingly?" It was a huge, innovative leap forward. It was far from perfect, but if they just kept iterating with the same spirit, I knew it would get to be something I loved. Alas, alas.

Exactly. Mint gave you a modern way to look at your finances instead of using your bank's terrible website.

But if it's not a modern way to look at finances....

Re: What happened to Mint?

#308
Are they still using YUI?

I left because it felt like updates never happened; they just lost or reset my cost basis for my three years worth of investment tracking at the time; and it was now owned by a company hostile to tax-payer convenience.

It felt great to leave.

Re: What happened to Mint?

#309
post #142

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm still on v4, it works great and I had to pay for it once. I know the model is subscriptions these days and $7/mo ($84/annual purchase) really is nothing in the big picture but it still bugs me. Looking through their release notes it doesn't appear that there has been major improvements in the budgeting aspect of the software. If you've used v4 is it worth it?

I'd go check the YNAB forums, there's a lot of v4 users who really hate the cloud version. I tried to switch and gave it up for two reasons: - Import from v4 is super broken for credit card accounts and I ended up with weird positive balances that don't add up based on any combination of transactions. Forum advice was "start over". - You cannot tag income as "available for next month", instead all income must be imme…

I don't think your 2nd bullet is completely true, although I don't think it's the same as how it worked in v4.

You can receive income in January, then switch to February and allocate it to a category. When you switch back to January, it will not show that money in your To Be Budgeted total. So you can zero out January while having the next month already budgeted for.

My system is to switch to the next month, select all categories, then click the "Budgeted Last Month" button to automatically apply my previous budget to that month. Then I switch back to the current month and fix any underfunded categories and allocate any overflows to get the balance down to zero.

Re: What happened to Mint?

#310

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’ve looked at a lot of budgeting apps. In order of priority, I want: 1. Don’t be evil (aka don’t be intuit) 2. Web based with some sane security (2fa, encryption at rest, etc) 3. The ability to sync transactions from my bank. 4. Budgeting/reporting. 5. Some sort of sane forecasting. You’ve got N months of data from a customer, why can’t you tell them in 6 months this account is expected to have $x in it? 6. Sane API…

I'm the founder of Buxfer ( https://www.buxfer.com ) Forecasting is one of the strongest aspects of our product. We also provide alerts ahead of time if we can predict your account balance will fall below zero (or whatever threshold you configure). Forecasting can also be used to preview your expenses/income/cashflow for the upcoming months / years. We do have an API, but I admit it's not the best around. Other than…

I like your privacy policy. It's reasonably easy to read, has a nice chart, and makes nice sounding promises.

Why don't you link to it from your home page? I had to do a Google site search to find it. (And maybe even put the 'what we share' chart somewhere more prominent)

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