Switching from Chrome to Firefox • Hacker News Board

Re: Switching from Chrome to Firefox

#301

Post by Eli_P » Tue, Dec 31, 2019, 7:27 AM UTC

bzbarsky wrote: post #249

Eli_P wrote: post #181

I found it interesting how Chrome and FF handle differently cpu-heavy code like this: arr = new ArrayBuffer(4) arrInt = new Uint32Array(arr) t0 = performance.now(); for (; arrInt[0] On Windows it takes 2.5 secs even on old chrome versions, while it never finishes on the latest FF. The latter's call stack says firefox.exe!TargetNtUnmapViewOfSection(), xul.dll!get_stored_pointer. I wonder if that happens on other platf…

Are you running that in a web page, or in the devtools console? I just tried running it in a web page, with the last line replaced by `console.log(performance.now() - t0);` and on my hardware it finishes in ~1.5 seconds in Firefox and ~2 seconds in Chrome. Similar if I run it in a devtools console like so: (function() { var arr = new ArrayBuffer(4) var arrInt = new Uint32Array(arr) t0 = performance.now(); for (; arrI…

> in the devtools console

Wow, you are right, thanks. Lesson learned.

Re: Switching from Chrome to Firefox

#302

Post by clement_b » Tue, Dec 31, 2019, 9:25 AM UTC

feanaro wrote: post #139

clement_b wrote: post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

OK for 'us'. But what about my mum and dad? What's the reason for them to use Firefox over Chrome? They don't care about the web being destroyed by Google and Apple. They care about... a smooth experience, I guess? They moved to Chrome from IE because of a very poor experience on IE. Chrome is amazing. Having most people switching away is a hard sell. I honestly think Brave has a more compelling selling point here, e…

Why does Brave have a more compelling sell? What does it offer that could be sold to users as a feature they need? I wouldn't know how to explain Brave compellingly, unless I'm using some of the same arguments I use for Firefox (which are weakened in Brave's case due to using the same engine as Chrome). On the other hand, explaining Firefox seems easy. People around me seem receptive to both privacy and closed garden…

When I read your comment, the main thing that came to my mind to explain my point about Brave was their Shield and Rewards features. That's what's top of mind for me.

I checked my Firefox window and realized that they have a Shield-like feature too. Oops.

To me, Firefox's main features are the underlying foundation, and the fact they are the main Chrome contender — the rest are nuances addressed to power-users. Containers. Frankly, it's too complex for a regular user [0] who, as you say, just click on what they have been used to clicking onto.

I'm having a hard time justifying my point further about Brave than by contradicting myself around the fact privacy alone is a weak selling point... Brave is all in on privacy, they have a really clear message about it, and regular users will understand better from their website that the browser natively blocks ads [1] and more importantly why e.g.:

> As a user, access to your web activity and data is sold to the highest bidder. Internet giants grow rich, while publishers go out of business. And the entire system is rife with ad fraud.

Comparatively, Firefox's homepage lacks details. The features are listed, but why are they useful to me... not sure. e.g.:

> Automatic privacy is here. Download Firefox to block over 2000 trackers.

> Firefox shows you how many data-collecting trackers are blocked with Enhanced Tracking Protection.

I understand both statements, but someone external to tech/ad tech will probably not see that as worth unless an expert explains why they should use that browser, exactly as you explained.

[0] https://support.mozilla.org/en-US/kb/containers [1] https://brave.com/wp-content/uploads/files_2019-11-home/imag...

Re: Switching from Chrome to Firefox

#303

Post by stiray » Tue, Dec 31, 2019, 11:05 AM UTC

paulddraper wrote: post #288

stiray wrote: post #237

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I love firefox but this is one hell of an annoyance I would beat author with a large trump. A hellofablob of dependencies etc. Like it was deliberately build to not self host it (and no I dont want docker). I really really really hate it for almost 10 years. There was a project rewritting it in go but was abandoned and probably the next thing I will develop will be a replacement .

> and no I dont want docker Forgive me, but it sounds like you just want to be unhappy about the distribution, because that solves your problem pretty well.

I have freebsd server and jails. Ergo, docker doesnt solve my problem.

Re: Switching from Chrome to Firefox

#304

Post by em-bee » Tue, Dec 31, 2019, 1:11 PM UTC

stiray wrote: post #237

ajphdiv wrote: post #231

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sync can also be self hosted. https://github.com/mozilla-services/syncserver

I love firefox but this is one hell of an annoyance I would beat author with a large trump. A hellofablob of dependencies etc. Like it was deliberately build to not self host it (and no I dont want docker). I really really really hate it for almost 10 years. There was a project rewritting it in go but was abandoned and probably the next thing I will develop will be a replacement .

maybe not deliberately, but i can imagine that it wasn't built with self-hosting in mind, until someone (from inside or outside) pushed for a self-hosting option.

is there a documented API? how much does it really take to sync? if it's browser encrypted it would really be just login, push or pull a blob. how hard can that be?

Re: Switching from Chrome to Firefox

#305

Post by em-bee » Tue, Dec 31, 2019, 1:13 PM UTC

m-p-3 wrote: post #224

mschuetz wrote: post #219

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> - about:preferences#general > Downloads > always ask where to save I hate the default behaviour so much. What's wrong with asking me where to save the file? I almost certainly have a place in mind where the file should go.

I prefer to dump everything in the Downloads folder and move files if they're needed on a longer term.

a useful default would be to ask for the location the first time something is saved and then provide the option to not ask again but reuse that location.

Re: Switching from Chrome to Firefox

#306

Post by wishinghand » Tue, Dec 31, 2019, 2:07 PM UTC

thibran wrote: post #175

Firefox is nice. But over time there are more and more things I need to configure to get a "good" browser experience. Things I do: - about:preferences#general > Startup > restore previous session - about:preferences#general > Tabs > uncheck Ctrl+Tab cycle ... - about:preferences#general > Downloads > always ask where to save - about:preferences#home > Firefox Home Content > disable all except Top Sites - about:prefer…

I can’t imagine why this is the top comment. You’re complaining that you have to set the preferences options to your personal preferences which will certainly differ from other users.

Re: Switching from Chrome to Firefox

#307

Post by frettchen » Tue, Dec 31, 2019, 4:48 PM UTC

juliend2 wrote: post #230

Not sure why, or if i'm the only one, but sometimes I have this problem with Firefox (latest) on Win10: When I open a new tab, there is a ~50% chance that the URL i'm querying won't ever connect. As if there was no internet. I tried to remove some open tabs (I have ~20 open tabs all the time) and it worked again. When it happens, opening a new tab on Chrome always works, though. I wasn't using a proxy and my internet…

I have the same issue on openSUSE Leap 15 - it's not Windows specific. I've found that the number of tabs doesn't matter too much - if I copy the URL of the non-loading tab, close the tab, open a new one and paste the URL there, it will load around 9/10 times (if it doesn't, third time is always the charm).

Drove me nuts enough that I switched to Brave for a bit as my main driver, but I've been experiencing some crashing from it recently and I miss my bookmark keywords, so I might go back.

Re: Switching from Chrome to Firefox

#308

Post by soulofmischief » Tue, Dec 31, 2019, 6:58 PM UTC

floatingatoll wrote: post #265

whatever_dude wrote: post #248

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My new pet theory is that software nowadays is _anti_ power user. In the 90s and 2000s, software came with a bunch of features that most users would want, and also a few small but powerful features that a tiny portion of their users ("power" users) really cared about. Almost every software had "power" features of some kind. A config file, command line arguments, that kind of stuff. Nowadays, popular software like Chr…

Power users often make it a priority to shut off in-product metrics that would represent their needs statistically. Since ‘power users’ as described are probably 0.01% or less of the world’s population, that’s probably less of a big deal for decision making than it sounds, but it’s always interesting to me to watch a subgroup dedicate itself to not being counted and then complain about the outcomes as if they didn’t…

This is a false dichotomy and a strawman.

The only two options are not either participating in often misused, grossly overreaching, non-configurable telemetry programs or disabling them completely.

And power users are not dedicating themselves to not helping the product getting better. You've gotten the argument twisted. We love to make software better by offering up information about how we use a product. However, in this climate the rational response is to disable all telemetry until the situation is under control with better legislation.

Don't paint this with the wrong colors. Power users are not the irrational group here, and this 0.01% figure which you based your argument on isn't grounded in reality, and therefore neither is your argument.

Re: Switching from Chrome to Firefox

#309

Post by kiwijamo » Tue, Dec 31, 2019, 8:49 PM UTC

majewsky wrote: post #157

kiwijamo wrote: post #104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It hasn't asked me to, as you say, automatically use Cloudflare's DoH service. The default seems to have DoH disabled.

It's not rolled out everywhere yet. AFAIK they only activate it for US users, and it may only be activated for a subset of those (not sure about that part).

I am outside the US so that explains it, thank you.

Re: Switching from Chrome to Firefox

#310

Post by Jaruzel » Tue, Dec 31, 2019, 10:23 PM UTC

lunchables wrote: post #252

Jaruzel wrote: post #201

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The one thing that really annoys me in all major browsers, is that you can't set a 'new tab page' without installing an extension. It's a nuts design.

Not sure exactly what you mean, but Firefox allows you to specify both new tab and new window behavior, even independently. Firefox Default, Custom page or just blank.

All I have for New Tabs is 'Firefox Home (Default)' and 'Blank Page', it does not allow me to set a Custom URL.

Which is why I have an extension installed to do it.