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US Navy will replace touchscreen with mechanical controls on its destroyers

theverge.com

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Re: US Navy will replace touchscreen with mechanical controls on its destroyers

#301

Post by flukus »

MisterTea wrote: post #224
Justsignedup wrote: post #198

Wait. Let me get this straight. Touchscreens, which are ideal for representing multiple user unterfaces in an intuitive way, but requiring constant visual contact are being replaced by a physical user interface that can be used by both touch, and memory? Why was touchscreen ever even a consideration for controls you're not looking at? Touchscreen is great for phones. It is awful for keyboards (see macbook pro). And i…

Well, it worked on Star Trek. Then again, that was addressed in a Voyager episode when Tom Paris designs the helm in their new runabout with old fashioned buttons and switches because he wanted to actually feel the controls much to Tuvok's dismay. Though, on a serious note, I work in industrial automation and user interfaces, aka HMI's have been touch oriented for quite some time. It was and still is common to see gr…

The federation also had to design interfaces to be universal and not assume bipedal humanoids with two hands and an oposable thumb, modern engineers have much narrower requirements.

Re: US Navy will replace touchscreen with mechanical controls on its destroyers

#302

Post by jacobolus »

beached_whale wrote: post #249
cameronbrown wrote: post #244

Earlier quoted context omitted.

tbf this could be achievable with Apple's virtual click tech. Would like to see how that'd work in practice.

I assume, that actions like turning/twisting do not work well on touch screens. you can do sliders but for somethings that may not give the correct control. I can probably turn a knob at finer increments than I can slide my finger on the screen.

> actions like turning/twisting do not work well on touch screens

Have you ever used an iPod (capacitive touchpad) scroll wheel?

A good physical knob is still better, but a touch wheel can be made pretty decent.

Re: US Navy will replace touchscreen with mechanical controls on its destroyers

#303

Post by gugagore »

jacobolus wrote: post #302
beached_whale wrote: post #249

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I assume, that actions like turning/twisting do not work well on touch screens. you can do sliders but for somethings that may not give the correct control. I can probably turn a knob at finer increments than I can slide my finger on the screen.

> actions like turning/twisting do not work well on touch screens Have you ever used an iPod (capacitive touchpad) scroll wheel? A good physical knob is still better, but a touch wheel can be made pretty decent.

I wonder if it's much easier to process the signal (at the level of measuring and interpreting the capacitances) if you assume a one-dimensional user input. I'm not sure what signal processing happens when sliding on a touchscreen/trackpad.

Re: US Navy will replace touchscreen with mechanical controls on its destroyers

#304

Post by [deleted] »

cletus wrote: post #110

Great. If only monitor manufacturers would do the same thing. I have a monitor with exactly 2 inputs (1 DP, 1 HDMI). What do I need to do to switch between them? 1. Press the Menu button 2. Move the option to Input Source 3. Select Input Source 4. Move from one to the other 5. Press Select Some monitor will compress 1-3 into a single Input Source option. Still, 3 presses? Why does literally NO ONE make a monitor with…

[deleted]

Re: US Navy will replace touchscreen with mechanical controls on its destroyers

#305

Post by gugagore »

cameronbrown wrote: post #244
starsinspace wrote: post #239

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Well, it worked on Star Trek. IIRC the official explanation from the makers of Star Trek is that the displays look like simple touch screens, but they are actually overlaid with structured force fields, so for the users it feels like a physical button press.

tbf this could be achievable with Apple's virtual click tech. Would like to see how that'd work in practice.

I imagine the star trek interact can really apply arbitrary forces. So you can simulate a knob for example. Not just a tactile sensation when you're already in (near) contact with the interface.

Re: US Navy will replace touchscreen with mechanical controls on its destroyers

#306

Post by crb002 »

situational87 wrote: post #11
crb002 wrote: post #3

Duh. Especially if an EMP hit.

Yes but instead of worrying about the theoretical EMP that has never happened and will never happen how about we worry about the fact that we keep crashing into merchant ships like on the regular? Engineering priorities and all that.

How about a capicitor bomb?

Re: US Navy will replace touchscreen with mechanical controls on its destroyers

#307

Post by gugagore »

CamperBob2 wrote: post #241
MisterTea wrote: post #224

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, it worked on Star Trek. Then again, that was addressed in a Voyager episode when Tom Paris designs the helm in their new runabout with old fashioned buttons and switches because he wanted to actually feel the controls much to Tuvok's dismay. Though, on a serious note, I work in industrial automation and user interfaces, aka HMI's have been touch oriented for quite some time. It was and still is common to see gr…

I installed encoder knobs to emulate potentiometers There's really no need to force this decision to go in either direction. Ever since I first heard of capacitive multitouch, going back to the timeframe before the first iPhone announcement, I've been waiting for someone to build 'stick-on' encoder knobs that the touchscreen controller can read. These would simply take the form of a knob with a metal leaf or other po…

It would require multi-touch displays. I have no idea how ubiquitous those are these days, but I know most touchscreens interfaces in my life have not supported it.

Re: US Navy will replace touchscreen with mechanical controls on its destroyers

#308

Post by ufmace »

octorian wrote: post #13
situational87 wrote: post #4

I'm having trouble visualizing exactly how this works from the text, but it sounds like a total nightmare. Some sort of complicated list of steps for transferring control screens between different stations on the ship, and it's not clear why or when you do this at all. I'm guessing the Navy doesn't spend a lot of time on UI/UX, which is ironic since these long, high-stress shifts with lives on the line is exactly whe…

In my own experience, any software developed under government contract has horrendous UI/UX. Probably because it's hard to specify "don't suck and be pleasant to use" in terms of formal system requirements.

I have seen the same thing for in-house corporate software. I don't think it's specific to government, but that any software that users are mandated to use and is developed for a small number of users will tend to have terrible UI. Particularly when the people building it are not allowed to talk directly to the people who will be using it, and have no idea how they do their jobs.

Re: US Navy will replace touchscreen with mechanical controls on its destroyers

#309

Post by gugagore »

ethbro wrote: post #294
heavenlyblue wrote: post #286

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What if the metal base of the rotatable knob has a certain rotationaly asymmetric pattern instead of being completely flat? We would then be able to receive that pattern and understand how the knob is rotated. What’s the resolution of todays touchscreen?

It's an interesting thought. You'd want to use a full bandwidth data channel (e.g. Bluetooth) for anything complicated. But for simple things, if possible without affecting the other parts of the screen, it'd be amazing to have a broadly supported, low bandwidth standard.

I can't really make sense of the bandwidth (information rate) of a tactile interface. A measure in units of length would make more sense to me.

Re: US Navy will replace touchscreen with mechanical controls on its destroyers

#310

Post by throwaway3627 »

Hey Skippy, don't get any water or coffee on the helm controls, or it might either not respond or go full ahead/reverse.

^-- Just one class of examples of what could wrong with not having physical controls.

Also, it takes a smaller explosive to crack/damage a touchscreen than physical controls into uncontrollability... and now you have a billion dollar paperweight.

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