Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Silicon Valley and Black Coders: Howard University fights to join the tech boom

bloomberg.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

301–310 of 497 posts

Re: Silicon Valley and Black Coders: Howard University fights to join the tech boom

#301

Post by sotojuan »

ebola1717 wrote: post #275
devalier wrote: post #128

Computer programming is one of the most cognitively demanding professions in existence. Ability to program correlates pretty highly with cognitive test scores, such as the SAT Math. If you look at the top scorers on such tests in America, only about 1% are black. The ratio of black engineers in Silicon Valley matches what you would expect based on the test scores. To see it visually, this is the bell curve based on m…

Wow, I'm sorry, but programming is not that demanding. Theoretical CS work can be, but the typical programmer is working on maintaining a crud app, especially as a junior developer.

I'd say only the interviews have become demanding!

Re: Silicon Valley and Black Coders: Howard University fights to join the tech boom

#302

Post by jfarmer »

fawefawef wrote: post #284
jfarmer wrote: post #271

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is like those folks who say that Arabs can't be anti-semitic because Arabic is a Semitic language and the Arabic people are a Semitic people. Or that some people are anti-semitic because of their hostility towards Arabs. At best, they're ignorant of the fact that the word "anti-semitic" is not defined literally but rather defined by the historical, sociological, cultural, and linguistic context in which it was m…

Yes. I do. Which is why the article is so ridiculous. What really defines who is black? Wesley Snipes is black because he's the darkest guy in Hollywood? What about a dark skinned Indian who shares 100% of the extra melanin generating genes? Maybe he's even darker than Wesley Snipes. But no... it must be a lighter skinned mulatto (most of the "blacks" you refer to have white ancestry due to race mixing) whose ancesto…

I can't tell if you're being sincere, but your attitude is common enough among well-meaning STEM types that I'll assume you are.

There never was nor will there ever be a cut-and-dried, scientifically-precise definition of "black." That's because the concept of "being black" and, in fact, the entire modern notion of "race" are inherently political in the broadest sense of the term. They were invented and subsequently weaponized as a means for a certain class of people to achieve their political outcomes at the expense of another class of people.

Again, I'm talking about the US only.

You are "black" if you are collectively labeled as "black", treated as "black", and are otherwise identified in whole or in part by your "black-ness". Yes, that means that someone's "black-ness" might vary across time, geography, socioeconomic status, who they're interacting with, and any number of other squishy-wishy, imprecise axes.

The idea that "being black" corresponds to something concrete and inherent in a person is part of the lie at the heart of the concept of "race".

Ta-Nehisi Coates writes about these things better than anyone I know. Here's an essay of his that touches on this idea: http://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2015/07/tanehisi...

Appropriately enough given the original link, the most relevant section begins with "My only Mecca was, is, and shall always be Howard University."

Re: Silicon Valley and Black Coders: Howard University fights to join the tech boom

#303

Post by sotojuan »

cballard wrote: post #253
stuxnet79 wrote: post #222

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Who also works in "sanitation" I am still incensed by this. The marketing of the movie totally misrepresented what Finn's role would be. I thought he would be the lead jedi. I doubt I will watch any of the forthcoming Star Wars movies.

That was, like, the point , though. I thought it was great when Finn turned out to be mostly useless at Jedi-ing and Rey was actually the main character, because I didn't see it coming after all of the trailers and ads. A bigger twist than, you know, the other one.

I was going to disagree but you are right. I only watched some trailers and I thought Finn would be the main character. He even wields a lightsaber in the official poster, despite the fact that he received no training nor he had the Force and only used it because he had nothing else to use and his life depended on it. I doubt he'll use it in the rest of the series—seems like he'll join Poe Dameron.

Re: Silicon Valley and Black Coders: Howard University fights to join the tech boom

#304

Post by caskance »

officemonkey wrote: post #46
Moshe_Silnorin wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As soon as a minorty achieves success (and often disproportionate success) they are no longer considered minorities.

If it were a game, it would be called "Whiteness unlocked." An Indian- or Chinese-American can attain "no longer considered minority" (aka whiteness) but African-Americans don't get that achievement.

>An Indian- or Chinese-American can attain "no longer considered minority" (aka whiteness)

Is this something white people actually believe?

Successful minorities don't become white. They become weapons white people wield against less successful minorities.

Re: Silicon Valley and Black Coders: Howard University fights to join the tech boom

#305

Post by SerpentJoe »

tw04 wrote: post #108
skywhopper wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I didn't find it surprising. I'm white, and I've been on all-white teams where everyone else watched the same TV shows or went to the same movies or played the same video games, and I didn't. Those common interests would feel like the only thing they ever talked about, and it would feel very unwelcoming. Part of the problem is just luck of the draw in terms of the team you get placed on. If that team is all into the…

So... you either decide you want to be included and try joining in some of the team's shared interests, or you don't. I'm not sure what the problem is - it's no different than being in a regular group of friends when some of them decide to pick up a new hobby/show/whatever. You can either engage and join in, or you can choose not to. Don't whine or act like there's something wrong if you make the decision not to part…

That may be, but nobody was whining. Your solution is in need of a problem.

Re: Silicon Valley and Black Coders: Howard University fights to join the tech boom

#306

Post by KingMob »

devalier wrote: post #196
alistproducer2 wrote: post #177

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your "sources" are dubious (at best). Why don't you link to some studies that back up your imgur you got from chimpout or some other fine upstanding white nationalist blog.

The imgur photo came from the Bell Curve by Charles Murray. There was some controversy about parts of the book, but the fact that blacks score one standard deviation lower on IQ tests was never disputed. You can also find this by just googling "race and SAT scores" "race and LSAT scores". Look at the official results put out by those organizations, and you will find that on every single test the average black score i…

The article you linked to failed to factor in stereotype threat, which suggests the authors have no idea how accurate the IQ test really is. Just because you're not asking questions like "Does the salad fork go on the outside or the inside?" doesn't mean the test is bias-free.

Re: Silicon Valley and Black Coders: Howard University fights to join the tech boom

#307

Post by worik »

rhino369 wrote: post #179
pingou wrote: post #126

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well I'm not an expert but it seems to me that in France we expect minorities to leave a good part of their culture and become "real french", eat cheese, wear beret and never walk without a baguette under their arms, whereas in the US I was under the impression that there's a lot more effort from minorities to differentiate themselves. I don't think we can really talk of a "black culture" in France (at least not in t…

America is undisputedly the best country at assimililating immigrants. It comes from doing it for centuries. We are one of the only countries with complete mixed ethnicities and a strong nationality. But that doesn't really work for blacks because they aren't a different culture, they are a subculture. Their culture has been a part of American culture from the beginning. For almost all of American history they were e…

"But that doesn't really work for blacks because they aren't a different culture, they are a subculture"

There you have it. Deep racism.

Re: Silicon Valley and Black Coders: Howard University fights to join the tech boom

#308

Post by lloyd-christmas »

panglott wrote: post #191
yoz-y wrote: post #159

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would say the main problem with French is that they really do not like to speak any other language than French. It is quite common that, for example, during the lunch with international participation and a French majority the conversation will start in English but then very quickly slip into French and then foreigners are lost. It has also happened to me, when speaking English or being in non-french speaking groups…

I would say the main problem with Americans is that they really do not like to speak any language other than English ;)

It's not about desire, but about practicality. It would take me a 10 hour drive to find somewhere where there is a significant population of "non-native" English speakers. I'm talking about Montreal, and that's the best attempt at comparison that I can make. Hop on a train in London and you're in Paris in 2.5 hours. Rent a car from there, drive 5 hours and you're in Frankfurt. You've hit 2 new languages in less time than it's taken me to find "1".

My mother is from Belgium and can barely speak french now after living here for 40 years. It's simply because the only practice she ever gets is the hour she spends on the phone with her aunt every couple of months. Unless I move, learning a language is just like any other hobby, only more impractical. I'd rather learn a new instrument to play every day than learn a new language to use once every 5 years.

Re: Silicon Valley and Black Coders: Howard University fights to join the tech boom

#309

Post by vacri »

rhino369 wrote: post #179
pingou wrote: post #126

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well I'm not an expert but it seems to me that in France we expect minorities to leave a good part of their culture and become "real french", eat cheese, wear beret and never walk without a baguette under their arms, whereas in the US I was under the impression that there's a lot more effort from minorities to differentiate themselves. I don't think we can really talk of a "black culture" in France (at least not in t…

America is undisputedly the best country at assimililating immigrants. It comes from doing it for centuries. We are one of the only countries with complete mixed ethnicities and a strong nationality. But that doesn't really work for blacks because they aren't a different culture, they are a subculture. Their culture has been a part of American culture from the beginning. For almost all of American history they were e…

> America is undisputedly the best country at assimililating immigrants. I'll dispute it.

  - Foreign-born US citizens: 14%
  - Foreign-born Australian citizens: 28% (without British, 21%)
Despite all the accusations of racism that Australia gets, we have a far higher proportion of foreign-born citizens than any other western democracy. The country seems to be doing fine.

edit: US is 14%. UK is 12% (as I originally had it). The comparison doesn't really change much, though.

Re: Silicon Valley and Black Coders: Howard University fights to join the tech boom

#310

Post by fawefawef »

jfarmer wrote: post #302
fawefawef wrote: post #284

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes. I do. Which is why the article is so ridiculous. What really defines who is black? Wesley Snipes is black because he's the darkest guy in Hollywood? What about a dark skinned Indian who shares 100% of the extra melanin generating genes? Maybe he's even darker than Wesley Snipes. But no... it must be a lighter skinned mulatto (most of the "blacks" you refer to have white ancestry due to race mixing) whose ancesto…

I can't tell if you're being sincere, but your attitude is common enough among well-meaning STEM types that I'll assume you are. There never was nor will there ever be a cut-and-dried, scientifically-precise definition of "black." That's because the concept of "being black" and, in fact, the entire modern notion of "race" are inherently political in the broadest sense of the term. They were invented and subsequently…

So you agree that the premise of the article is wrong. They should at least clarify which "blacks" they are talking about here. If they are only considering the race-mixed descendents of chattel slavery in the US, who are in fact, "less black" than people on the horn of Africa and in southern India, then sure, why not. But since your definition includes "there is no race", why even bother to talk about "blacks" at all in the first place.
Post reply on HN