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Why is it taking longer and longer to fill open jobs?

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Re: Why is it taking longer and longer to fill open jobs?

#31

Post by GreenPlastic »

smil wrote: post #22
GreenPlastic wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Posted a senior iOS dev position to Indeed, LinkedIn, Glassdoor where the company is paying 25%(maybe 40% if you include RSUs) above market here (although we don't put comp in the job listing) and only got 3 applicants in a month.

So compensation is not relevant to your point at all since you didn't list it. Or were you looking for mind readers? The low response rate makes sense in that case.

Fair enough, but the information is publicly available on glassdoor.

A couple reasons why I didn't list comp:

1. I didn't want to get candidates purely motivated by the high cash comp in the area. 2. Cash comp isn't core to how the company markets itself to employees and its culture. The company prefers to sell itself on being an employee friendly place to work.

Like the article hypothesizes, I thought we'd get 50-100 resumes because it's so easy to apply for jobs on the internet and was surprised at how few we actually got.

Re: Why is it taking longer and longer to fill open jobs?

#33

Post by xeni »

GreenPlastic wrote: post #24
GreenPlastic wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Posted a senior iOS dev position to Indeed, LinkedIn, Glassdoor where the company is paying 25%(maybe 40% if you include RSUs) above market here (although we don't put comp in the job listing) and only got 3 applicants in a month.

Can't post the exact description but the jist of it was: Strong understanding of objective C and iOS SDK Swift experience a plus Passion for design / UX Proven track record of quality apps in app store That's literally all I had under qualifications.

Ahh, why exactly don't you list compensation?

Also, I think you should mention some details:

The size of the team -- lone iOS developer, small team (2-4 people), or larger?

Whether the application is a standalone mobile app (and the business is built around it), or simply a frontend for a pre-existing web application/product. (i.e. Working on Tinder versus working on OKCupid's mobile app)

Disregard this if you included this already in the actual listing, and/or you're hiring for an iOS shop that will be dealing with outsourced projects

Degree of control/ownership that the developer will have on the project

I think you will attract different candidates based on these cases.

Re: Why is it taking longer and longer to fill open jobs?

#34

Post by colechristensen »

* Employers overvalue experience, forgetting that a human is a fantastic machine and with appropriate training and management, most people will be able to do most jobs.

* Communication is hard: both writing resumes and job descriptions – it becomes this strange difficult-to-play game that both sides engage in often having little to nothing to do with the actual job

* Education is poor: at all levels actual learning is not emphasized. Especially learning how to do things. From preschool to graduate school, the game of education far surpasses actual learning. Students aren't interested in learning and teachers are only interested in grades and tests.

Re: Why is it taking longer and longer to fill open jobs?

#35

Post by GreenPlastic »

ryandrake wrote: post #25
GreenPlastic wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can't post the exact description but the jist of it was: Strong understanding of objective C and iOS SDK Swift experience a plus Passion for design / UX Proven track record of quality apps in app store That's literally all I had under qualifications.

What did you have under "here are some great benefits" or "why it's awesome to work here"?

Leaned on the company's official materials for this. Employee focused culture where we work hard and play hard. XX on best companies to work for list. Fast growing company with great benefits, dogs allowed at work, etc.

Re: Why is it taking longer and longer to fill open jobs?

#36

Post by gcb0 »

commandar wrote: post #29
th0ma5 wrote: post #2

I think this misinterprets something deliberately, and misses some things entirely. It mentions that wages have been stagnant as proof that it isn't that people aren't applying for jobs that have low pay, but only uses wage statistics as evidence for that, which doesn't really indicate one way or the other that such is the situation. I think the thing it really misses is the increased conceptualization of open positi…

>After harassing HR at my company, I finally made a lateral move where my manager told me he thought at the time of hiring that they needed someone and they thought I might be able scrape by, but now they want me to find someone else just like me. I so relate to this. I was specifically poached from one department by another for a new position within my company. HR process requires internal transfers to apply for the…

A. you were enough to get the job done but wasn't the person to change the game. B. they knew that person was out there but they were failing to reach out to then

Re: Why is it taking longer and longer to fill open jobs?

#37

Post by GreenPlastic »

xeni wrote: post #33
GreenPlastic wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can't post the exact description but the jist of it was: Strong understanding of objective C and iOS SDK Swift experience a plus Passion for design / UX Proven track record of quality apps in app store That's literally all I had under qualifications.

Ahh, why exactly don't you list compensation? Also, I think you should mention some details: The size of the team -- lone iOS developer, small team (2-4 people), or larger? Whether the application is a standalone mobile app (and the business is built around it), or simply a frontend for a pre-existing web application/product. (i.e. Working on Tinder versus working on OKCupid's mobile app) Disregard this if you includ…

See above. Mostly because I thought that listing cash comp was inconsistent with how the company markets itself to employees and the company's culture, which tends to be more on the humble side.

I did have some information about the work in there but nothing really about the team size - I'll keep that in mind for future listings. Completely agree on your statement that the type of candidate you'll attract depends on the team, the company, the project.

Re: Why is it taking longer and longer to fill open jobs?

#38

Post by ryandrake »

mc32 wrote: post #27
ryandrake wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So, make sure there are no better offers out there. If you think your employees are going to leave after you train them, that's a problem you can solve.

Yes, but you have already invested money into them by hiring "green" (underproductive) workers. Someone else didn't have that burden so it's easy for them to pay a bit more to get the trained worker. So everyone is trying to get this trained worker "ready to hit the ground running".

Get creative. Admittedly super-simplified example: Would you find it sensible to hire someone inexperienced at 70% of market value, with a written guarantee to increase him/her to 110% after (let's say 6 months of) training? After 2.5 years, you've gotten 2 productive years out of him, and you have paid him (total) the same as you'd have paid an instantly productive person for 2 years. And they're not going anywhere because they're making more than market rate.

Re: Why is it taking longer and longer to fill open jobs?

#39

Post by memracom »

Don't well written cover letters help employers quickly evaluate a large number of applications?

And don't complain that you don't get them along with the resumes. 1) Ask for a cover letter explaining why you are a fit for the job. 2) Discard applications that don't include them. 3) Resist the urge to look through the resumes anyway.

And if you directly ask for a cover letter, and you get anm application that doesn't have one, send the applicant a form letter that says. "This is a form letter. Apparently you do not care about finding a job because you failed to follow the instructions in the job posting. We have deleted your application/email. If you still want to be considered for the job, apply again WITH A COVER LETTER that explains why you are the right fit for the job".

If Employers want Job Applicants to do the right thing, then they need to be proactive and teach. Nobody else trains job applicants how to apply for a job, how to help the employer see quickly that you deserve to get an interview.

Re: Why is it taking longer and longer to fill open jobs?

#40

Post by Decade »

GreenPlastic wrote: post #26
smil wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sure, but this is not a relevant response to my comment unless you meant it as an insult.

Wasn't meant as an insult. Just have a lot of phone screens where people list 100 technologies on a resume and don't have a rudimentary understanding of any. The majority of candidates have never used source control or haven't spent the time to brush up on basic data structures questions.

That's because there are thousands of job openings and a ton of stuff to do. I don't have enough hours in a day to implement all the job seeker advice I've been given.

Your adversarial approach to hiring doesn't help. You think of it as filtering out incompetents so you can concentrate on successful candidates. I think of it as shooting down candidates without giving them a chance to show what they can do.

I suspect that your job requirements may be a bit unrealistic. Expert at Objective C and Swift and design with apps in the App Store? Chances are that person already has a happy job, probably working for Apple.

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