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Amazon Can Now Test Its Delivery Drones in the U.S

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Re: Amazon Can Now Test Its Delivery Drones in the U.S

#31

Post by jsprogrammer »

vijayr wrote: post #24
serge2k wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We shouldn't be impeding progress to save jobs. I believe an ultimate goal should be to reach the point where people don't need jobs.

I wonder the suffering that humanity has to go through before we reach a stage where we don't need jobs (assuming it is even possible to reach that stage). If we can replace human workers systematically, thoughtfully and steadily with the goal of freeing humans from work (at least most of it), that would be awesome. But I can't think of a single leader/country who is that forward thinking and smart. Every new technol…

You could become that leader and/or petition your country to be that forward thinking and smart.

It (displacement) does seem to be a huge risk and it's probably better to devise solutions now rather than after huge displacements have occurred.

Re: Amazon Can Now Test Its Delivery Drones in the U.S

#32

Post by jsprogrammer »

cmurf wrote: post #29
serge2k wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We shouldn't be impeding progress to save jobs. I believe an ultimate goal should be to reach the point where people don't need jobs.

OK. But what's your proposal for how they get food, clothing, living space? The labor portion of food, clothing, shelter being automated only eliminated a part of their cost. They still have a cost, so if people don't have jobs, how do they continue to acquire the things they need to live?

I've been thinking about this for awhile. I believe that the dependency graphs need to be made explicit and open. Everyone should be able to see what resources there are, which are being used for what, the entire supply chain, and projections.

We'll likely need new distributed protocols to be able to make group decisions about things, but I think we'll be able to get a long way just by making key information widely available.

Re: Amazon Can Now Test Its Delivery Drones in the U.S

#33

Post by trhway »

merger wrote: post #26
trhway wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Quadcopter Drones are just not viable for delivery with current battery technology. AMZN can allow itself to implement infrastructure/process to use something like Al metal-air cells. Stick in, stick out, sent resulting Al oxide to re-processing. You'll get efficiency and range of at least gas engine without mess/maintenance. There are more advanced schemas available (like potassium based - more energy dense, easier…

Something just tells me transportation is not going to be the industry revolutionized by drones. I'm sure they'll revolutionize another industry, and another tech will revolutionize tansportation. I guess at least companies are dreaming again and trying crazy ideas, aka "moonshots".

>I guess at least companies are dreaming again and trying crazy ideas, aka "moonshots".

Sitting on "moonshot" sized piles of cash and having engineering pools of that scale, one can expect that at least some would try ... I mean actual placement of Amazon logo on the Moon (like say using 100 "dots" - very bright LED array panels) would cost only something like few billion dollars.

Re: Amazon Can Now Test Its Delivery Drones in the U.S

#34

Post by zero_iq »

cmurf wrote: post #29
serge2k wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We shouldn't be impeding progress to save jobs. I believe an ultimate goal should be to reach the point where people don't need jobs.

OK. But what's your proposal for how they get food, clothing, living space? The labor portion of food, clothing, shelter being automated only eliminated a part of their cost. They still have a cost, so if people don't have jobs, how do they continue to acquire the things they need to live?

You just ask for them at the nearest replicator terminal ;p

Re: Amazon Can Now Test Its Delivery Drones in the U.S

#35

Post by evv »

jsprogrammer wrote: post #30
manachar wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you see a human doing something it's only because it's too expensive for a robot/machine/software to do it. Delightfully, robot comes from a Czech word originating in "hard work, servitude, serfdom". Basically a slave. Any business looking to drive down costs push their human components as close to slavery as is allowable by law or acceptable to the workers. So when people fight to preserve human jobs in say, fast…

Why would one need to 'make profits' in a post-employment world?

If you have all the resources you need to live out the rest of your life, then you wouldn't. Most of us aren't so lucky.

Re: Amazon Can Now Test Its Delivery Drones in the U.S

#36

Post by jsprogrammer »

merger wrote: post #6
startupfounder wrote: post #3

I have mixed feelings about the rapid pace that technology is replacing human jobs. As a consumer I couldn't be happier about getting things delivered faster and higher quality experiences with sub 1 hour delivery. Across the board technology companies are replacing humans and consolidating services. My concern comes when I think about the accelerating rate that technology is replacing human jobs faster than humans c…

Quadcopter Drones are just not viable for delivery with current battery technology. Maximum lift is a couple of pounds for 15-20 minutes of flight. Wide use of overhead power lines in cities makes drone delivery unsafe in cities. Rural areas could make sense, lots of open space for landing, sparse population and long drives for drivers,straightforward navigation and obstacle avoidance. But that's not something Quadco…

Why do we need overhead power lines again? Distribute the generation of electricity (solar, fuel cell, wind) and connect it all via underground wiring.

Re: Amazon Can Now Test Its Delivery Drones in the U.S

#37

Post by georgemcbay »

trhway wrote: post #13
Crito wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ultimately better education isn't going to be good enough. 100 workers replaced by a robot won't all get 100 jobs fixing or making that robot. Buggy-whip factory workers may have found new jobs in car factories, but it would be a mistake to assume that is how things will always play out. Unless we want serious societal unrest, I am convinced that we need to get something like basic income off the ground sooner rather…

>100 workers replaced by a robot won't all get 100 jobs fixing or making that robot. they will get jobs servicing each other as doctors, teachers, nurses, lawyers, soldiers, playwriters, government clerks/officers, etc... Basically actively employed in a re-distribution of the products made by the robots. Government for example one can see as an instance of such basic income program (it just comes with such strings a…

The funny thing about your post is that the law profession is one of the hardest hit by automation over the past few years... not exactly a safe haven for people fleeing other fields.

Automation isn't just about factories full of robots, it is about software allowing 1 professional to do the job that 10-20 people used to do.

A field doesn't have to be fully automated before automation destroys the economic viability of the field for possible newcomers to it.

Re: Amazon Can Now Test Its Delivery Drones in the U.S

#38

Post by jsprogrammer »

rhino369 wrote: post #8
merger wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Quadcopter Drones are just not viable for delivery with current battery technology. Maximum lift is a couple of pounds for 15-20 minutes of flight. Wide use of overhead power lines in cities makes drone delivery unsafe in cities. Rural areas could make sense, lots of open space for landing, sparse population and long drives for drivers,straightforward navigation and obstacle avoidance. But that's not something Quadco…

Are gasoline quadcopters viable?

I don't think we need autonomous machines flying around polluting (noise and chemical) spaces.

Re: Amazon Can Now Test Its Delivery Drones in the U.S

#39

Post by manachar »

jsprogrammer wrote: post #30
manachar wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you see a human doing something it's only because it's too expensive for a robot/machine/software to do it. Delightfully, robot comes from a Czech word originating in "hard work, servitude, serfdom". Basically a slave. Any business looking to drive down costs push their human components as close to slavery as is allowable by law or acceptable to the workers. So when people fight to preserve human jobs in say, fast…

Why would one need to 'make profits' in a post-employment world?

Why do billionaires need profits? Probably different reasons for each person. For some, it's just a way of keeping score.

Re: Amazon Can Now Test Its Delivery Drones in the U.S

#40

Post by vijayr »

jsprogrammer wrote: post #31
vijayr wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wonder the suffering that humanity has to go through before we reach a stage where we don't need jobs (assuming it is even possible to reach that stage). If we can replace human workers systematically, thoughtfully and steadily with the goal of freeing humans from work (at least most of it), that would be awesome. But I can't think of a single leader/country who is that forward thinking and smart. Every new technol…

You could become that leader and/or petition your country to be that forward thinking and smart. It (displacement) does seem to be a huge risk and it's probably better to devise solutions now rather than after huge displacements have occurred.

Yeah, I was thinking along the same lines. This is a global problem and it needs to be addressed at global level. Assuming self driving cars (just one example) becomes a reality in at least western countries in the next decade, does any one have any plan to help those humans that are going to be replaced? I was only trying to point out that our current group of political leaders don't seem to think that far ahead. Ideas like basic income etc needs lots of planning, testing etc at smaller levels before they can be implemented at a larger scale if we want to keep social unrest to a minimum.
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