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MySQL 5.7.6 is out

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Re: MySQL 5.7.6 is out

#31

Post by kidmenot »

taf2 wrote: post #8

So much MySQL hate these days... I should try Postgres out but here's why I still like and trust MySQL or MariaDB/Percona... 1. It's reliable/durable 2. I know the tools (mysql command line is friendly to me) 3. It's performance is predictable. 99% of issues with performance are easily solved with the right index 4. I don't find myself needing many SQL features beyond the basics. Also, I'm a happy user of other tools…

>4. I don't find myself needing many SQL features beyond the basics.

That's probably why you still like it. As it stands, MySQL has so many shortcomings it's not even funny.

Version 5.7 is the first one to support multiple triggers per event. Beyond that, and just to name a few, you can't have subselects in views, you don't have CTEs (good luck storing hierarchical data in an adjacency list), no materialized views, CHECK constraints are parsed but ignored.

I'm glad it works for you, but the minute you need to do something slightly more complex, MySQL gets in your way.

I hope the situation will improve, though.

Re: MySQL 5.7.6 is out

#32

Post by jordigh »

morgo wrote: post #23
jordigh wrote: post #22

Dear lazyweb, How active is the MariaDB development compared to MySQL's? Should we still be concerned with Oracle trying to kill MySQL? How has that whole debacle played out?

Edward Screven addresses this point in this video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fzCpd4j72jA - Oracle sees MySQL users as a distinct group of customers from the Oracle Database - 5 years on, the engineering team on MySQL is 2x what it was when acquired. By a simple metric (LoC), MySQL 5.6 has a larger delta than any previous release: https://www.flamingspork.com/blog/2013/03/05/mysql-code-size... Edit: See also thi…

And I unlazied myself a little and found this:

https://mariadb.com/kb/en/mariadb/mariadb-vs-mysql-features/

If marketing is to be believed, it does seem like MariaDB offers many points of attraction over MySQL. The fact that Oracle does not provide test cases or has proprietary extensions is a bit alarming from a software freedom perspective.

Re: MySQL 5.7.6 is out

#33

Post by tsuraan »

morgo wrote: post #19
pilif wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>1. It's reliable/durable I would personally contest that. I've seen MySQL corrupt tables before and the insanely unhelpful defaults which make MySQL accept and alter invalid data really don't strike me as neither reliable nor durable. Your other points are valid reasons for sticking with MySQL though. If you're happy and the tool does what you need, that's fine. But once you've seen what you can do as you gain acces…

In the context of this post (MySQL 5.7) it does not accept invalid data :) The default sql mode has changed.

So, MySQL, as of 5.7, no longer accepts dates with year 0, and it also stopped converting unrecognized date strings into the date 00-00-0000? That would be a very positive change.

Re: MySQL 5.7.6 is out

#34

Post by IgorPartola »

morgo wrote: post #30
IgorPartola wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

MySQL is a fine DB for most cases. There are some specific features it lacks that do make it annoying (and make Postgres a better choice): 1. Indexes are too simplistic. You can't index the output of a function. 2. InnoDB lacks full text search. MyISAM has it, but MyISAM is bad since it doesn't support transactions. 3. Unicode support by default does not support all Unicode characters. That's right, even though it sa…

1. We're working on something in this area: http://mysqlserverteam.com/generated-columns-in-mysql-5-7-5/ 2. InnoDB has fulltext from MySQL 5.6+ 3. I agree utf8mb4 should be renamed "utf8". When this was introduced it was given a new name to support downgrades, but the feature does exist :) 4. RAND() is actually deterministic (via other meta data written to the binlog). In any case, MySQL also supports Row-based repli…

Thanks. I'll add one more and maybe this is already in the works: last I checked you couldn't rebuilt an index of an InnoDB table without re-inserting all the rows into a table. This meant that adding an index to a huge table was very slow.

I didn't know about a lot of these improvements, and am happy that they are happening. I moved away from MySQL around 2012-2013 because of the above reasons, so glad that things are improving.

Re: MySQL 5.7.6 is out

#35

Post by jordigh »

morgo wrote: post #9

Community Manager for MySQL here! A better overview link for what's new in 5.7.6 specifically is this one: http://mysqlserverteam.com/the-mysql-5-7-6-milestone-release... To understand what's new in 5.7 overall: http://dev.mysql.com/doc/refman/5.7/en/mysql-nutshell.html Specific to this blog post. Here is the page on upgrading: http://dev.mysql.com/doc/refman/5.7/en/upgrading-from-previo... I'm happy to answer any qu…

> Community Manager for MySQL here!

I always found this title a bit weird. How does one exactly manage a community? :-)

https://plus.google.com/+AaronSeigo/posts/DHEx1tu5dSK

Re: MySQL 5.7.6 is out

#36

Post by kbenson »

pilif wrote: post #24
kyrra wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Corruption issues are fairly true with MyISAM engine. InnoDB did a lot to help reliability of tables (it can auto-correct them in cases where you had a hard poweroff or other related issues). No more needing to manually run table scans to detect corruption. What "advanced SQL features" do other DB products have that you cannot do with MySQL?

CTEs, range types, window functions, custom aggregates, functional indexes, conditional indexes, proper utf-8 support and once you bring Postgres with its unique features into the mix: kick-ass JSON support (including the usage of indexes), array support (any my best friend array_agg()) Regarding corruption, it's an anecdote, but my girlfriend has lost a ton of data for her thesis related to innodb corruption. It too…

It's not pretty, but you can get the equivalent of range types using variables[1].

Regarding corruption, it's an anecdote, but my girlfriend has lost a ton of data for her thesis related to innodb corruption. It took me hours of bit-twiddling to get the data back (and into Postgres where it's safe and accessible since then - on the same hardware, so don't blame this to broken hardware)

It's not safe until it's backed up. I don't care if it's a $100k oracle installation, It's not safe until it's backed up. Even then it's suspect...

1: http://stackoverflow.com/questions/17147920/postgres-window-...

Re: MySQL 5.7.6 is out

#37

Post by morgo »

jordigh wrote: post #35
morgo wrote: post #9

Community Manager for MySQL here! A better overview link for what's new in 5.7.6 specifically is this one: http://mysqlserverteam.com/the-mysql-5-7-6-milestone-release... To understand what's new in 5.7 overall: http://dev.mysql.com/doc/refman/5.7/en/mysql-nutshell.html Specific to this blog post. Here is the page on upgrading: http://dev.mysql.com/doc/refman/5.7/en/upgrading-from-previo... I'm happy to answer any qu…

> Community Manager for MySQL here! I always found this title a bit weird. How does one exactly manage a community? :-) https://plus.google.com/+AaronSeigo/posts/DHEx1tu5dSK

Please see my comments on this thread: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=8318199

I agree it's a silly name, but it's not like we created it :)

Re: MySQL 5.7.6 is out

#38

Post by morgo »

IgorPartola wrote: post #34
morgo wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

1. We're working on something in this area: http://mysqlserverteam.com/generated-columns-in-mysql-5-7-5/ 2. InnoDB has fulltext from MySQL 5.6+ 3. I agree utf8mb4 should be renamed "utf8". When this was introduced it was given a new name to support downgrades, but the feature does exist :) 4. RAND() is actually deterministic (via other meta data written to the binlog). In any case, MySQL also supports Row-based repli…

Thanks. I'll add one more and maybe this is already in the works: last I checked you couldn't rebuilt an index of an InnoDB table without re-inserting all the rows into a table. This meant that adding an index to a huge table was very slow. I didn't know about a lot of these improvements, and am happy that they are happening. I moved away from MySQL around 2012-2013 because of the above reasons, so glad that things a…

MySQL 5.6 supports Online DDL. Most operations are online, you can see a list at: http://dev.mysql.com/doc/refman/5.6/en/innodb-create-index-o...

(The table 14.5 column "Allows Concurrent DML?" is the interesting one.)

Re: MySQL 5.7.6 is out

#39

Post by ddorian43 »

morgo wrote: post #37
jordigh wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Community Manager for MySQL here! I always found this title a bit weird. How does one exactly manage a community? :-) https://plus.google.com/+AaronSeigo/posts/DHEx1tu5dSK

Please see my comments on this thread: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=8318199 I agree it's a silly name, but it's not like we created it :)

Click on the datetime of the comment to get the correct comment-link:

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=8318807

Re: MySQL 5.7.6 is out

#40

Post by meritt »

pilif wrote: post #24
kyrra wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Corruption issues are fairly true with MyISAM engine. InnoDB did a lot to help reliability of tables (it can auto-correct them in cases where you had a hard poweroff or other related issues). No more needing to manually run table scans to detect corruption. What "advanced SQL features" do other DB products have that you cannot do with MySQL?

CTEs, range types, window functions, custom aggregates, functional indexes, conditional indexes, proper utf-8 support and once you bring Postgres with its unique features into the mix: kick-ass JSON support (including the usage of indexes), array support (any my best friend array_agg()) Regarding corruption, it's an anecdote, but my girlfriend has lost a ton of data for her thesis related to innodb corruption. It too…

As a long-time and fairly technical MySQL user and only light experience with PostgreSQL, can you suggest the best reading material (in addition to the user manual) on the subject?

Comparatively, for MySQL, my recommendation would be 'High Performance MySQL'.

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