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Show HN: Make School – College replacement for founders and developers

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Re: Show HN: Make School – College replacement for founders and developers

#32
post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

considering the price tag of those schools, they should be the most vulnerable to competition

But almost all top schools have needs-blind admissions which means that if you get in, they will provide the financial aid that you need if you can't afford it. So it's actually very unlikely someone gets into a top school but then decides it's not worth the money (assuming the school is worth the money, which it is, and the only issue is whether they can afford it right now).

what college adminstrators will decide you need, and what you think you might need, can differ significantly

Re: Show HN: Make School – College replacement for founders and developers

#34
post #4

I'm confused. College is amazing. Why would you want a college replacement? >Your education will be focused on building apps and websites that improve the lives of those around you. Getting a wide-ranging liberal education was never really that important, huh?

College student here, and college has not been so amazing. I wish that the whole e-learning/computer science oriented college alternatives thing took off when I was still in high school. My tuition amounts to ~$30k a year (without grants), which is pretty ridiculous - especially considering the "quality" of the classes. Granted, the social life is nice, but it's hard to maintain that social life when I'm busy making…

If you're not happy with the education then do something about it.

One great option that isn't presented often enough is to transfer to a different institution. Don't think that just because the school you're at sucks for you that all of them will. In some cases you can actually get into a better school than you got into out of high school as a transfer student (although some schools are weird about accepting transfers, Google can help).

Also, note that I said "for you", very few, if any, colleges or universities in the US suck in general. Some are stronger or weaker in certain areas, some emphasize certain aspects of education over others, and some will better prepare you for various jobs than others, but it is an individual evaluation.

Another thing to keep in mind is whether what you're hoping to get out of school is really what colleges and universities offer. Maybe college isn't right for you. Colleges and universities do not prepare you for a job (with a few notable exceptions like professional programs such as law and medical school, and certain business programs). Instead, they prepare you to prepare yourself for a job.

A lot of people like to trash the emphasis on theory in academic CS programs, but if you pay attention, and work hard (which it sounds like you are, with your side projects) the theory becomes pretty damn useful later when you get a job and you're shown a couple hundred (or thousand if you're really "lucky") lines of spaghetti code and asked to figure out why it is "slow", etc. A lot of people don't take the time to digest the theory they learn and therefore they aren't able to apply it to real problems when they go out into the world. Don't make that mistake.

However, does everyone need those exact skills? Nope, we need tons of people who can pump out relatively simple, relatively repetitive (though not enough to automate) code for relatively standard applications. We also need people who can maintain that (and other) code, write tests, automate processes, and a hundred other things each requiring a slightly different mixture of skills, not all of which are (or should be) taught in college. Additionally, and this is important for startups, we need people who have strong social and organizational skills, who don't necessarily spend all day writing code (not to mention the hardware people, everyone always forgets about them :)

So instead of plowing $30k/year into an education you aren't sure you want, you might want to think about a different path. Do some research. If other schools are stronger in what you want to learn, maybe you should transfer. It could also be that college just isn't what you should be doing right now, perhaps a program as described in TFA, or one of the other "code schools" would be more your style and better fits your interests. You can usually go back to college and pick up where you left off if you change your mind (although depending on the school your tuition might go up in that case).

Re: Show HN: Make School – College replacement for founders and developers

#35
Great idea, two years seems like too long though. It shouldn't take more than 6 - 9 months to learn the basics of being a full stack web developer, with another 6 - 9 months to actually become competent enough to work semi-independently. I think it would make more sense to make the program 18 months, and then have things like swift and devops as optional six-month extensions.

Re: Show HN: Make School – College replacement for founders and developers

#36

Sounds like a good program, at least from your marketing. But I would market is an alternative to college, not a replacement. It is a just a matter of word choice, but the word replacement could take you down a road of comparison that isn't required and may distract your efforts. "Alternative" lets you focus on what you offer, and the value it will bring to a student's life, without getting caught into the mess of ar…

I agree, but I would take it further. I worry that things that are already somewhat lacking in a lot of CS degrees, like having a reasonable background in mathematics, are only made further problematic. This program sounds excellent if you just wanted to be an app developer, but if you get tasked to do something a little out in the weeds, one has to wonder what other aspects of education got shortchanged.

Re: Show HN: Make School – College replacement for founders and developers

#37
post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

College student here, and college has not been so amazing. I wish that the whole e-learning/computer science oriented college alternatives thing took off when I was still in high school. My tuition amounts to ~$30k a year (without grants), which is pretty ridiculous - especially considering the "quality" of the classes. Granted, the social life is nice, but it's hard to maintain that social life when I'm busy making…

If you're not happy with the education then do something about it . One great option that isn't presented often enough is to transfer to a different institution. Don't think that just because the school you're at sucks for you that all of them will. In some cases you can actually get into a better school than you got into out of high school as a transfer student (although some schools are weird about accepting transf…

Does a CS education at all prepare one to deal with spaghetti code? My impression from working with CS degreeholders is that maintainability and craftsmanship is completely orthogonal to algorithms and theory.

Re: Show HN: Make School – College replacement for founders and developers

#38
I think I would far rather see this as a supplement to college than a replacement. I know it's in vogue today to claim that education is about "job training," but I worry that this attitude is short sighted and destructive. Saying that you're a "replacement" to a quality four year degree is also rather arrogant.

Re: Show HN: Make School – College replacement for founders and developers

#39
These types of programs represent a funny trend in the SV tech scene: While workers of every other sector are busy increasing the barrier of entry in order to reduce competition for jobs, every other week some new startup / bootcamp / code school wants to tear down the barriers and provide "CS for the masses". Of course a noble goal, but if it actually works, it also means the end of the privileged, six-figure-entry-salary, 20%-of-your-time-free tech jobs.

Re: Show HN: Make School – College replacement for founders and developers

#40
post #8

I really like the innovative funding model, although intuitively it seems pretty high risk?

"intuitively it seems pretty high risk" for who?

For the company. Depending on how it is implemented, taking a cut of the first 2 years' salary could be very high risk. Intuitively there seems to be little to stop someone taking the education and then absconding abroad.
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