Pixie: A sweet Clojure-ish language

Post by ajuc » Mon, Mar 09, 2015, 10:31 AM UTC

mateuszf wrote: post #16

threeseed wrote: post #7

This seems like bit of a short sighted move not that I disagree with it. Project Jigsaw which will be a big part of Java 9 aims to make the JVM more modular which will reduce the memory footprint substantially. Personally I would like to see a version of Clojure that targets this JVM specifically and abandons backwards compatibility. Leaving the JVM means you abandon the decade of libraries many of which you simply c…

In fact JVM is pretty fast. If you run a simple java app without dependencies and only displaying "Hello world" it will run in about 1s on modern hardware. The problem with Clojure is AFAIR related to parsing and loading a big number of namespaces which is quite slow.

    real    0m1.240s
    user    0m0.902s
    sys     0m0.343s

    real    0m4.952s
    user    0m4.051s
    sys     0m1.071s

Post by afandian » Mon, Mar 09, 2015, 10:32 AM UTC

bjz_ wrote: post #30

afandian wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There aren't many languages that have radically fewer parentheses than Clojure / LISP. Clojure: (defn blub-extra [a b] (blub (inc a) (inc b))) 8 parens + 2 brackets Scala: def blubExtra(a: Int, b: Int): Int { blub(inc(a), inc(b)) } 8 parens + 2 braces Java: Integer blubExtra(Integer a, Integer b) { return blub(inc(a), inc(b)); } 8 parens + 2 braces Ruby: def blubExtra(a, b) blub(inc(a), inc(b)) end 8 parens Python: d…

I think it's the positioning of them that makes them stand out to people, plus the fact that they tend to bunch up at the end of things.

Post by lmm » Mon, Mar 09, 2015, 10:46 AM UTC

tsmarsh wrote: post #24

lmm wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Embedding an immutable language in a mutable one is a recipe for awkwardness - how would you expose host-language things to the inner language? Better to do it the other way around - mutable scripting language embedded inside immutable host.

Clojure is an immutable language built on top of mutable hosts. Interop is handled beautifully. A go hosted Clojure (gojure?) would probably be fine.

Post by mateuszf » Mon, Mar 09, 2015, 10:48 AM UTC

fijal wrote: post #21

mateuszf wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In fact JVM is pretty fast. If you run a simple java app without dependencies and only displaying "Hello world" it will run in about 1s on modern hardware. The problem with Clojure is AFAIR related to parsing and loading a big number of namespaces which is quite slow.

1s to print hello world is an awful lot I would like to point out.

Post by wz1000 » Mon, Mar 09, 2015, 10:50 AM UTC

JackMorgan wrote: post #34

smenko wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Clojure is horribly unsafe. I spent a year writing Clojure and half the time we were fixing bugs where someone had wrapped a map in another map or changed the shape of a data structure. For all that's worth, I'd rather use Javascript. To add insult to injury (the amount of wasted time on something that could be easily checked by a compiler and a sane type system) there's all the bad habits you acquire and the general…

Sounds like you needed Schema, which can ensure the shape and contents of a map as :pre and :post assertions in every function you annotate, then be turned off for production use. https://github.com/Prismatic/schema That's why I come back to Clojure every time, if I need anything, it's available as a library. Need better typesafety? Just add in what you need with a macro or two. (Schema is not much more than that). T…