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The First Browser Dedicated to Developers Is Coming

blog.mozilla.org

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Re: The First Browser Dedicated to Developers Is Coming

#31

Post by coldtea »

daigoba66 wrote: post #25

So I'm actually a fan of leaving dev tools installed and available in a normal user's web browser; whether it's IE, Chrome, FireFox, or whatever. If a user is reporting some bug or issue that's difficult to reproduce, I like being able to just hit F12 _on their computer_ and diagnose and debug. Sometimes I can guide the user, sometimes I do it remotely. Having the ability to debug software like that is phenomenal.

It's not like anyone has taken that away from you.

And as for the new tool, since it also shares the Mozilla engine, it's as if you're using Firefox (+ some plugins) with regards to web behavior.

Re: The First Browser Dedicated to Developers Is Coming

#32

Post by andrewstuart2 »

I can see where a dedicated browser for development could be a little more helpful during the 80% phase of development. My main concern however is that some of that remaining 20% is cross-platform stuff that you can't get right in a single browser.

Unless they incorporate tiled views from different rendering engines. That would be awesome.

Re: The First Browser Dedicated to Developers Is Coming

#33

Post by cageface »

At Mozilla we know that developers are the cornerstone of the Web, that’s why we actively push standards and continue to build great tools to make it easier for you to create awesome Web content and apps.

Like canning WebSQL for spurious reasons and forcing people to use a half-baked spec like IndexedDB instead? As much as I applaud most of what Mozilla has done to further the interests of the open web it's hard to forget how profoundly they sabotaged the development of the browser as an application platform with this particular piece of political NIH grandstanding.

Re: The First Browser Dedicated to Developers Is Coming

#34

Post by giiduh »

andrewstuart2 wrote: post #32

I can see where a dedicated browser for development could be a little more helpful during the 80% phase of development. My main concern however is that some of that remaining 20% is cross-platform stuff that you can't get right in a single browser. Unless they incorporate tiled views from different rendering engines. That would be awesome.

^Tiled views would be really awesome!

Re: The First Browser Dedicated to Developers Is Coming

#35

Post by untog »

cageface wrote: post #33

At Mozilla we know that developers are the cornerstone of the Web, that’s why we actively push standards and continue to build great tools to make it easier for you to create awesome Web content and apps. Like canning WebSQL for spurious reasons and forcing people to use a half-baked spec like IndexedDB instead? As much as I applaud most of what Mozilla has done to further the interests of the open web it's hard to f…

It's hardly grandstanding when it's the standard everyone agreed on.

I agree that IndexedDB is awful and WebSQL was much better, but go shout at the W3C, not Mozilla.

Re: The First Browser Dedicated to Developers Is Coming

#37

Post by cageface »

untog wrote: post #35
cageface wrote: post #33

At Mozilla we know that developers are the cornerstone of the Web, that’s why we actively push standards and continue to build great tools to make it easier for you to create awesome Web content and apps. Like canning WebSQL for spurious reasons and forcing people to use a half-baked spec like IndexedDB instead? As much as I applaud most of what Mozilla has done to further the interests of the open web it's hard to f…

It's hardly grandstanding when it's the standard everyone agreed on. I agree that IndexedDB is awful and WebSQL was much better, but go shout at the W3C, not Mozilla.

It was Mozilla's insistence on IndexedDB that tipped the balance. WebSQL was already well supported in Chrome and Safari and if Mozilla hadn't inexplicably come down on Microsoft's side we would have a reasonable client-side database solution today.

Lest this particular piece of villainy be forgotten: https://hacks.mozilla.org/2010/06/beyond-html5-database-apis...

Re: The First Browser Dedicated to Developers Is Coming

#38

Post by vinceguidry »

emotionalcode wrote: post #30
vinceguidry wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's going to lower the barrier to entry for young people who want to get into more than just the kiddie stuff. I know when I was a kid, I was smart enough for BASIC and Pascal but C++ just looked weird and complex and hard. HTML, CSS and Javascript were awesome and I jumped into that instead. Neat integrated tools are great for beginners. What drives a divide is when you go build an entire ecosystem and hand it off…

> I know when I was a kid, I was smart enough for BASIC and Pascal but C++ just looked weird and complex and hard. HTML, CSS and Javascript were awesome and I jumped into that instead. When I was a kid, C++ was easy and I didn't start learning javascript until a few years ago. I also learned TI-BASIC in AP Calc, and Java (CS II-Honors) was presented at my school as harder than C++ (CS I). A lot of what is labeled dif…

> When I was just learning to program, I was afraid to ask questions, to talk about what I knew or thought.

I suppose you're right. When I was learning, there was no one to ask questions to. Glad that's changed.

Re: The First Browser Dedicated to Developers Is Coming

#40

Post by soapdog »

maresca wrote: post #36

Is there a firefox plugin that lets me edit CSS in the developer tools AND lets me save the edits back to the actual CSS stylesheet on my machine? I'd love to see that functionality.

You don't need a plugin for that. In Firefox Nightly that is already enabled.

You can check this article that shows editing LESS and SASS inside the browser and saving it to the original location on your HD:

https://hacks.mozilla.org/2014/02/live-editing-sass-and-less...

Firefox has lots of awesome devtools but people still think in terms of Firebug and haven't noticed all the new goodies.

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