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Please remove mitsuhiko/*

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Re: Please remove mitsuhiko/*

#31

Post by lotsofmangos »

waterlesscloud wrote: post #17
gerbal wrote: post #13

I'm confused to why this project is a good idea. It seems like they are collecting funds on behalf of a third party without that third parties consent and then distributing those funds, again without third parties knowledge or consent. As much as the project seems to have good intentions, insisting that It's BitCoin, BitCoin is different doesn't mean your product is actually exempt from rules and law. Or that Bitcoin…

Can you point to where they believe they are immune to the rules because they're using Bitcoin? To me it just looks like a badly implemented concept that happens to use Bitcoin. I'm not seeing any Bitcoin exceptionalism here.

The Bitcoin exceptionalism is clear in this bit:

----

arsenische - Do I need to learn all the laws of all the countries before publishing anything online or may I just use the common sense and conscience please?

mitsuhiko - To be honest: when it comes to handling money I would assume so. If this website would be dealing with a real world currency you would have a bunch of problems on yourself at this point. Most people would avoid holding funds on their books for an unlimited amount of time.

Don't build software you have to opt-out of and you have a lot less problems on your hand. Right now, this is dangerously close to being sued by someone.

arsenische - That's why this kind of project is hardly possible with traditional money. This project was created during a 48 hour rails rumble competition. The beauty of Bitcoin is that everybody can use it to create something during a weekend.

This is not a commercial project, we don't have resources to hire lawyers and accountants.

---

From this it seems that not only do they think it avoids legal issues, but they do not consider publicly raising bitcoin to be a commercial project that needs lawyers or accountants.

Re: Please remove mitsuhiko/*

#32

Post by matrix »

sfk wrote: post #14

If open source parasites like tip4commit don't learn, the next logical step is to trademark projects and send DMCA notices without wasting any further time. Also, with this kind of sleazy behavior, the advertising clause in the BSD license suddenly becomes very appealing again.

Agreed. This behavior is not benign "naughtiness" (as the YC guys like to encourage), it's parasitic exploitation of other people's hard work. Another group I'd lump in with this group is readthedocs.org

Re: Please remove mitsuhiko/*

#33

Post by ubernostrum »

teamhappy wrote: post #25
jedanbik wrote: post #11

This is gross to read because it's really about consent.

I disagree. He explicitly consented to everybody doing whatever they want with the software. I just don't think it's fair to allow people to do one thing and then make them feel bad about it once they do it. --- Let me clarify a couple of things here so I don't have to write short replies to all of you. Let's start with the 3-clause-BSD license. It states that you aren't allowed to use the names of the contributors t…

Armin tends to BSD-license his work. And the BSD license includes a provision which forbids use of contributor names for endorsement/promotion without permission.

So, no, "consent" is not what Armin did. In fact, he did the opposite of that.

Re: Please remove mitsuhiko/*

#34

Post by teamhappy »

ubernostrum wrote: post #33
teamhappy wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I disagree. He explicitly consented to everybody doing whatever they want with the software. I just don't think it's fair to allow people to do one thing and then make them feel bad about it once they do it. --- Let me clarify a couple of things here so I don't have to write short replies to all of you. Let's start with the 3-clause-BSD license. It states that you aren't allowed to use the names of the contributors t…

Armin tends to BSD-license his work. And the BSD license includes a provision which forbids use of contributor names for endorsement/promotion without permission. So, no, "consent" is not what Armin did. In fact, he did the opposite of that.

> The names of the contributors may not be used to endorse or promote products derived from this software without specific prior written permission.

As far as I can tell (!) there are no products derived from the software. Neither do they mention the names of the contributors. Please correct me if I'm wrong.

Re: Please remove mitsuhiko/*

#35

Post by waterlesscloud »

lotsofmangos wrote: post #31
waterlesscloud wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can you point to where they believe they are immune to the rules because they're using Bitcoin? To me it just looks like a badly implemented concept that happens to use Bitcoin. I'm not seeing any Bitcoin exceptionalism here.

The Bitcoin exceptionalism is clear in this bit: ---- arsenische - Do I need to learn all the laws of all the countries before publishing anything online or may I just use the common sense and conscience please? mitsuhiko - To be honest: when it comes to handling money I would assume so. If this website would be dealing with a real world currency you would have a bunch of problems on yourself at this point. Most peop…

Hmm. I can partially agree with that take on what they're saying.

Though it seems more like they're saying "We have no resources but were able to this because it uses Bitcoin" than "We're immune to laws because we're using Bitcoin".

Although this situation points out that there is a fundamental conflict with Bitcoin and the established systems that's going to require an adjustment period.

While it's certainly true that laws governing money, accounting, finance, etc. can, will, and do apply to Bitcoin, the fact still remains that it's really easy to move money around electronically outside of institutional controls. Previously, the laws controlling electronic transfer have been enforced via the institutions, and that's no longer entirely possible.

Some things will have to change, it will be interesting to see how it shakes out.

Re: Please remove mitsuhiko/*

#36

Post by maxerickson »

teamhappy wrote: post #25
jedanbik wrote: post #11

This is gross to read because it's really about consent.

I disagree. He explicitly consented to everybody doing whatever they want with the software. I just don't think it's fair to allow people to do one thing and then make them feel bad about it once they do it. --- Let me clarify a couple of things here so I don't have to write short replies to all of you. Let's start with the 3-clause-BSD license. It states that you aren't allowed to use the names of the contributors t…

The consent isn't about the software, it's about the name/handle.

Whatever the legal specifics might be, I think you'll find that an awful lot of people think it is obnoxious to collect money (or so) on behalf of someone else without having them agree to it first.

Re: Please remove mitsuhiko/*

#37

Post by Dewie »

I received a tip from tip4commit for a merged pull request to some github repository. The tip was too small to "cash out" on though, and I think I might have needed 40 or more tips like that in order to get a sum that was redeemable.

Re: Please remove mitsuhiko/*

#38

Post by 0x0 »

ubernostrum wrote: post #9
josu wrote: post #4

Could somebody please provide some context?

tip4commit is one of a number of services which, without asking for permission or notifying you, opt your projects into a BitCoin-based crowdfunding system. Even if your project doesn't want it, even if your project has its own donation/support system you'd like to send people to. Historically they spammed committers of force-opted-in repositories with an email on every commit to tell them what their new BTC donation…

Maybe try reporting every email they send to spamcop? That should give their hosting provider a pretty good incentive to block their email sending privileges.

Re: Please remove mitsuhiko/*

#39

Post by drothlis »

teamhappy wrote: post #25
jedanbik wrote: post #11

This is gross to read because it's really about consent.

I disagree. He explicitly consented to everybody doing whatever they want with the software. I just don't think it's fair to allow people to do one thing and then make them feel bad about it once they do it. --- Let me clarify a couple of things here so I don't have to write short replies to all of you. Let's start with the 3-clause-BSD license. It states that you aren't allowed to use the names of the contributors t…

Copyright != Trademark.

Re: Please remove mitsuhiko/*

#40

Post by teamhappy »

maxerickson wrote: post #36
teamhappy wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I disagree. He explicitly consented to everybody doing whatever they want with the software. I just don't think it's fair to allow people to do one thing and then make them feel bad about it once they do it. --- Let me clarify a couple of things here so I don't have to write short replies to all of you. Let's start with the 3-clause-BSD license. It states that you aren't allowed to use the names of the contributors t…

The consent isn't about the software, it's about the name/handle. Whatever the legal specifics might be, I think you'll find that an awful lot of people think it is obnoxious to collect money (or so) on behalf of someone else without having them agree to it first.

As far as the nickname goes, yes, I happen to be one of these people. I'm pretty sure you can't collect money on other people's behalf though.
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